Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour) | Oireachtas source

The issue that Senator Moloney has raised is an issue that has developed for all social welfare systems. Some employers want highly flexible labour contracts where a person is offered a very minimum number of hours yet he or she must remain available to the employer. In effect, the employer must pay for the actual hours worked on his or her premises and social welfare pays the balance. Inevitably, as people return to work, much of the work they will first encounter may be part time, contractual and atypical. What if large sectors were to become part-time employers where employers just paid people for the exact hours worked but did not give them enough hours yet social welfare had to pay the rest? We would have an enormously increased social welfare bill and employment would be extremely precarious.

Some employers are moving to zero hour based contracts. In my view, people need a living wage. We have a minimum wage in Ireland which is set at a relatively high level when compared with other European countries. What if a person only gets eight hours work at the minimum wage or continuously earns €2 or €3 above the minimum wage? Everybody can understand that during periods of downturn, like the one that we are experiencing now, some of these developments are inevitable. If zero-based contracts became the norm then the social welfare system would become extremely difficult to fund because not enough people at work would have enough hours to generate a sufficient income to be financially independent. One would then have continuing and enormous deficits in the social welfare system.

In London, the concept of a London living wage has been promoted. The aim is to have a decent rate of pay but sufficient hours to ensure that people have an income.

Senator Moloney commented on how difficult it is for workers such as lollipop ladies and canteen staff in schools to find more weeks of work. Obviously schools, because of funding issues, must let such staff go during the summer holidays and those staff must sign on for social welfare.

Certainly, in most areas that issue was resolved some time ago and for those who are let go from their jobs during the summer, social welfare covers the balance. However, in a way this means that social welfare is carrying the cost of their downtime. This year, for instance, the Department of Social Protection will pay more than €220 million in family income supplement, that is, to people with children who work a number of hours but whose income still is too low and who need a top-up. Members should recall the Department is trying to design a social welfare system in which work is always worthwhile and in which no one states a preference to take social welfare payments rather than work. However, as we return to recovery, many of the initial jobs are likely to be part-time and the statistics show this. We certainly must work at trying to provide people with sufficient hours to have a living wage, which is quite important.