Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour) | Oireachtas source

I was not present for the debate on Second State, so I wish to elaborate on a couple of matters now. I am concerned to have legislation which will be fit for purpose in 20 or 30 years' time. The reality is that we have a public private partnership in education. The public side is the State, which sets the curriculum, pays salaries, regulates the examination process, etc. At primary level we have different patrons and at secondary level we have VEC schools, as they currently are, and the free voluntary sector and in between are the community schools. For reasons of history and social change and given the strength of private sector partners at both primary and secondary level and the decrease in numbers - this is not in any way a partisan religious comment and I do not want it to be taken as such - I am of the view that the ETBs will be able to deliver to educational providers, on a non-compulsory basis, certain services. For example, if a principal of a school sought to have something done under the summer works scheme, subject to the agreement of the Catholic Primary School Management Association, CPSMA - the dominant patron - half a dozen contracts for small works projects in the relevant area could be carried out under the supervision of the ETB. This would free up the principal in question, who would not be a project manager or building contractor in the first instance. Human resources and IT support and a host of other supports could be provided at the request of the school in question. This would happen at primary level and in the free voluntary sector. By definition, the VEC schools will have access to the services to which I refer.

I must inform Senator Barrett that if I, through a statutory instrument, were to make a specification in respect of the provision in section 30(9) whereby one of the bodies to be appointed "shall be a body established for the purpose of representing the interests of persons engaged in the management of, or leadership in, recognised schools" in the next two to three months, the CPSMA, the joint management body, JMB - which crosses both religious denominations - Educate Together and the various other stakeholders would be invited to nominate people for consideration in order that they might be represented. Education providers at primary and secondary level have informed me that they are nervous about a traditional VEC body which would be a provider of education in the broader sense and which would also have a stake in its own schools. They are of the view that there is a possible conflict there. If we want to have better co-operation between the free voluntary sector and the VEC schools, as they currently are, then the stakeholders involved should have a voice on the education and training boards.

This will be for future Ministers for Education and Skills and Governments to decide but I am of the view that we will need a much stronger local education partner to operate with the Department of Education and Skills at central level. There are things which we simply cannot do at national level that VECs or their successor bodies could do. However, they will not be able to do these things unless the educational stakeholders are of the view that they have a role to play at the heart of the ETBs, namely, on their boards. That is the thinking behind the relevant provision. The principle in enunciated in the primary legislation and the bodes to which I have just referred are those I have in mind in order that we might give effect to what is envisaged in the next year or so. Names will be put forward by the nominating bodies and, ultimately, it will be the responsibility of the boards of the ETBs to select who they wish to fill the relevant posts. They will not merely be able to appoint a friend of a friend of a friend to positions.

We all know that it happened, irrespective of which group was dominant. It is to have a two-tiered system.

Based on precedent, many of the 12 local authority members are teachers, for example, principals or subject teachers in second level schools. They are not present in an institutional capacity, but they are a strong component in every elected assembly across Europe for all sorts of reasons. The teaching voice is not silenced because it does not have a formal representative. Senator Barrett should consider himself.