John Gilroy (Labour) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister and I am glad the senior Minister has come to the House. It demonstrates the importance of this legislation. The Bill gives expression to the provisions of the treaty the people voted in favour of in the springtime. During the referendum debate, there was great deal of misinformation and some of the arguments were not as we would hope or what we strive towards. We do not want to revisit or relive the arguments in favour of and against the treaty. It is prudent to implement fiscal rules, as Senator Sean Barrett proposed in December last year, that make provision for balanced budgets, which is prudent, and for contingencies arising when budgets become unbalanced in rare and exceptional circumstances and for mechanisms to deal with that. Despite some of the comments at the time of the treaty, its passing has led to improved levels of confidence in Ireland and Europe. We can see evidence of that in falling interest rates charged on Irish debt and on the return of the NTMA to the markets, albeit in treasury bills and short-term debt. Nevertheless, it is encouraging and significant and stems from the confidence in our economy gained across Europe by the people of Ireland accepting the provisions of the Bill. The enshrinement of the rules into legislation will go towards consolidating confidence.

Those who were opponents of the treaty at the time are noticeably silent on what may have happened if we had rejected the provisions of the treaty. If we had followed the course of action proposed by the opponents of the treaty at the time we would not be in the position we are in now, albeit in a fragile position. The idea was proposed at the time that in passing the treaty we were somehow conceding some level of sovereignty to unnamed and unimaginable forces in Europe but the fact that we are bringing the legislation into the House demonstrates that our autonomy in that regard at least remains in our hands.

Senator Darragh O'Brien was correct in his comments earlier in regard to monetary union when it was set up and that France, Germany and the larger economies of Europe had seemingly found it expedient not to live within the Stability and Growth Pact rules. When the larger economies could do so with impunity there was very little incentive for smaller economies to attempt to live within the measures.

I have much more to say about this and some of it might be more appropriate to raise on Committee Stage. I refer to section 7 and the establishment of the fiscal council. I note from the Minister's contribution and the notes we have on this that the fiscal council will monitor and assess the provisions of the Bill but where is the report published by the fiscal committee? Where does responsibility for action on the recommendations in the report lie? Does it lie with the Department of Finance or ECOFIN? It is certainly welcome that a report would be published in advance of the budget but I am not sure what is actionable and who is responsible for that action. That is one question I want to put to the Minister.

The Minister will recall there was a great deal of comment in political and academic circles, and in the committee set up to discuss the fiscal treaty at the time which was chaired very well by Deputy Hannigan, on the difficulty of arriving at an agreed formula to establish what exactly would constitute a structural deficit. I understand more may need to be done on that but from what I have read on that I am not sure how we will agree on what constitutes the structural deficit and who will be responsible. Will we do it ourselves? How does it fit in with the European structures, and what happens if there is lack of agreement on what constitutes the structural deficit?

If the Minister could answer those two questions I will ask more on Committee Stage and they are probably more appropriate to it. I acknowledge Senator Barrett's contribution, as did the Minister who generously accepted most of the provisions of what Senator Barrett suggested last December. I will leave it at that and return to this on Committee Stage when I look forward to opportunity to tease this out further.