Averil Power (Fianna Fail)

I welcome the Minister to the House. In particular, I welcome the report on patronage. An enormous amount of work has been put into it, not only on the part of the Minister but by the group, headed by Professor John Coolahan, which has put significant effort into this work during the past year. It is clear from reading it that there was a strong culture of co-operation among the different groups, albeit of very different persuasions and with different visions of where education might go. They worked together in a spirit of co-operation and understanding over the past year. It is an excellent report. The first chapter provides an interesting outline of the development of our education system, from 1831 until today, and how its character has changed over that period. It gives good input to this debate.

As the Minister pointed out, society has changed dramatically in recent times and as it has, so have our schools. New procedures put in place by successive Fianna Fáil Ministers have led to significant diversity in the patronage of new schools, those that have come into being in the past five to ten years. Most of these have been multi or non-denominational schools. Existing schools have also adapted as best they could to changes in the social and religious make-up of their communities. Although the vast majority of Irish primary schools are under Catholic patronage, increasingly they have welcomed children of all faiths and none. This often requires a great deal of effort, particularly from staff, as they try to cater equally for every child. There has also been an element of compromise on the part of patrons in ensuring they are reaching out and making all children feel welcome and respected. The growth of Irish-medium education in the past 20 years has also been a remarkably positive development, with the number of students enrolled in Irish-speaking primary and second level schools outside Gaeltacht areas having doubled since the early 1990s.

Although our schools have adapted as best they could in their current patronage arrangements and within the system in which they were set up, it is clear from reading the submissions to the forum on patronage and pluralism that there is considerable disquiet about the current position among all the partners in education. On the one hand, denominational patrons and management bodies are concerned about having to compromise their ethos. They state that if they are running a denominational school they want to provide a denominational education and wish that to vivify everything that happens in the school, from the first day the child comes in until he or she leaves at the end of the day. At the other end, it is clear there is an increasing mismatch between the current patronage arrangements for nationals schools and the wishes of parents. The forum quotes different research studies made on this point in recent years. In addition, the Irish Primary Principals Network published research this week highlighting the fact that three out of four parents with dependent children who responded to the Red C poll carried out for the IPPN stated that, if they had a choice, they would send their children to schools with patron bodies other than the church. It is extraordinary, given 96% of our primary schools are under denominational patronage that 75% of parents state that is not what they want. That obviously poses a great challenge, not only to the Minister but to Members of this House as they seek to represent the views of parents and ensure the education system adapts.

It is equally interesting to note from the IPPN survey that although the vast majority of parents did not want the church to manage or be owners of the schools, they wanted religion delivered during the school day. That presents an even more interesting challenge for schools, in that although parents want to see a totally different management body, perhaps more State involvement or a more secular level of management, they are very clear that they want a religious element to their children's education. Many parents see religious education as a core part of their children's education even in schools under alternative patronage.

Fianna Fáil appreciates that some parents do not want their children to undergo faith formation in any one creed at school. At the same time, we recognise that other parents view faith formation as a vital part of their child's education and believe schools must play a part in delivering that. We welcome the recommendations in the report for stand-alone schools which we believe to be positive. The reality is that in many areas there will only be the one school and it should cater equally for everybody, in both its ceremonial practices and in terms of how it treats its students and staff. This relates to the context of the debate the House will have tomorrow. Every school that receives public funding from the State should be open equally to everybody and should treat everybody with equal respect. We welcome the recommendations made concerning stand-alone schools.

In respect of other schools, particularly those in urban areas and areas where there is a multiplicity of schools, we have a concern I wish to put on the record, as we did in our submission to the forum last year. There is no doubt we are at a crossroads in that the current system does not work and we have to change it. However, we have a choice as we go forward as a society. As we seek to cater for diversity, do we want to meet the challenge of diversity by having different schools, with different children heading in different directions in the morning, based on their faith? Alternatively do we believe we can meet the diversity challenge within each school and ensure that each can cater equally for either the faith or the non-belief of every child?

Fianna Fáil recognises and cherishes the contribution the churches have made to Irish education. There is no doubt that church authorities provided educational opportunities for young people long before the State began to play a significant role. Experience also shows that minority religious schools, such as small Church of Ireland schools in rural areas, have played a vital role in protecting the vitality and viability of their communities throughout the years. As we head forward to the future, particularly at this juncture when long-term policy is being set out and we are setting up a new framework, I reiterate our concern that we should make the right choices about how diversity should be catered for into the future. When we wrote our initial submission to the forum last year, we noted that although there is no doubt the existing patronage arrangements need to evolve, we would be concerned if the divesting of schools by the Catholic Church would lead, over time, to children being segregated on religious lines. That could create further social problems that thankfully we have avoided to date, again because denominational schools have catered as best they could for everybody, children of all faiths and none. Senator Bacik is nodding her head. I am not saying people are happy with the current arrangements but while there is a cross over the door in Catholic schools and they are called St. Mary's or St. Paul's, the goodwill of teachers means they have gone out of their way to cater for everyone. Northern Ireland is an extreme example but in other countries in Europe, when people get up in the morning the Catholics go one-way, the Protestants go another and the Muslims go another. People are split up for the day. That is regrettable. When one walks into a rural school in Ireland they have symbols from various religions and they celebrate feast days. The level of multifaith and multicultural understanding was not there when I was in school, which is not so long ago. It is positive and as we look to the future we must be careful to avoid segregation, which we have not had to deal with to date.

We accept that some parents want to have faith provision within the school day and others are equally opposed to it. A model of patronage should be found to bring all children together while allowing for religious education. This philosophy underpins the announcement of a new patronage model, the community national school, by the then Minister for Education and Science, Mary Hanafin, in 2007. I welcome the fact the Minister gave approval last month for new community national schools to open over the next two years. The pilot community national schools have much to recommend them and it is positive that children of different faiths are taught together. There have been teething problems but it is a pilot programme and the first time the State has directly run primary schools, apart from the model school beside the Minister's Department. It is breaking new ground and while it is a positive idea in theory, it must be evaluated. The scheme should not be expanded until that is done. Lessons can be learned from the pilot scheme and a road can be mapped out for the future. A spokesperson for the Minister told the Irish Examiner that while the Minister was not in government when the model was approved, he is satisfied it is operating in an inclusive fashion, which will allow it to grow and develop in accordance with the wishes of parents and communities. I am glad the Minister can see the benefits of it and I am sure he is aware of the challenges. Fianna Fáil will support it.

This is a major project and while my party welcomed the setting up of the forum, we recognise the challenges and expressed considerable disquiet at the idea of transferring up to 50% of schools overnight or taking the big bang approach. That was endorsed by the report.