Ruairi Quinn (Dublin South East, Labour)

I thank the Senators for their contributions. I understand Senator Rónán Mullen's concerns. However, we are talking about a very clear and defined area of potential industrial relations difficulties, namely, the redeployment of a teacher who has become supernumerary to one school and is appointed to a panel from which he or she must, under the employment control framework, be redeployed before new recruits can be entered into the education system. The provision is ringfenced in its applicability to that scenario. If he is not satisfied the Senator will have a further chance to raise this matter on Report Stage - I am not inviting him to do so, but he will have that opportunity.

It is important to stress that the Department of Education and Skills does not normally work by fiat. We receive our mandate and resources from this and the other House. Moreover, some might argue that the Department has, over time, been far too consultative and facilitative in its engagement with the education partners. It is not the culture of Marlborough Street to issue fiats, whatever else one may say about it.

It being one of the youngest languages in the world and a polyglot or fusion of other languages, the English language has a rich treasury of words with the same meaning. For example, another word for agreement is "unanimity". Unanimity also implies a veto, as we have seen in the dialogue of the European Union in terms of Council meetings. In this case, we are talking about a potential industrial relations situation. The Senator will know from his own work that there could be officials on the employer's side and on the union side and that they may, following consultation, reach an agreement as to what is reasonable. However, the individual concerned could simply refuse to give his or her agreement, essentially exercising a veto. The provision relates to those very few occasions when such a situation may arise.

Last year there was very successful redeployment of a large number of people who found themselves on panels. Good work was done by senior officials in the Department, but they came back with the observation that it would be wise to modify this proposal by way of a miscellaneous item of education legislation I have gone further than that, because I do not want to carve it into statute law. I am saying to the social partners in education, who have a good ongoing working relationship - the Senator and others who may want to have their voice heard, particularly on the patron side, can also have an input into this - let us get a broad understanding of what consultation and agreement mean so that we do not have to debate their meaning ab initio in every individual case.

I say that without prejudice. Senator Feargal Quinn, who has a great deal of managerial experience in these areas, made an important point about the difficulties that can arise. A 100% agreement is a rare beast and somebody may want to be unco-operative. The consequences of a lack of co-operation are not neutral and affect other people who, for example, may not get a job until an ECF supernumerary is redeployed.