Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)

Gabhaim buíochas don Seanadóir Barrett. Is obair thábhachtach é an Bille seo. Mar a dúirt Seanadóirí eile, ba cheart dúinn tuilleadh oibre mar seo a dhéanamh sa Seanad. I thank the Senator Barrett for bringing forward the Bill.

While I welcome the Minister of State's comments about the Government introducing legislation, unfortunately, the last time he said that was during the summer about a Fianna Fáil Bill on the family home, when he said there would be a big announcement before the budget and that Senators would have a free vote. Unfortunatley, the Fianna Fáil Bill was voted down. It would send a huge signal about parliamentary and Seanad reform and democracy if the Government stayed silent on this Bill and did not oppose it. It should be allowed to sit on Second Stage. It is unlikely to reach Committee Stage, but it would put more pressure on the Government to deliver on its commitments under the four year plan, the EU-IMF agreement and the programme for Government. I urge the Government to stay silent and allow the Bill to pass.

It is up to Senator Sean D. Barrett to decide whether he wants to take Senator David Norris's advice, which was to adjourn the debate on the Bill before time was up. He would have to discuss that issue with the Government Whip to see if the Government would be prepared to facilitate this. It would send such a positive message that we were taking our role seriously and doing something constructive designed to help the Government and country while avoiding the disasters outlined. Had the Bill been in place ten years ago and if we had done more of what Charlie McCreevy wanted to do and less of what some of the other voices who are giving out now about the Government wanted, we would be in a far better place.

It is incredible work, but we must make the point about parliamentary reform, that on these issues on which we are not in conflict and not attacking the Government but saving the State money, the Seanad must stand on its own two feet and not force a division on this Bill. It must make a statement of support to the Government but also give recognition to the fact that parliamentarians can come in here and draft legislation, which is our fundamental duty. Whatever way the Bill goes, I urge the Department of Finance to invite Senator Sean D. Barrett in to sit down with them. He might have to give out to some of the officials, but he is a nice man and does it in a nice way, except for students who got into trouble at Trinity College where he was something of a disciplinarian.

I am concerned about the Minister of State's remarks about the rules suggested last Friday for the fiscal responsibility Bill. It seems to be very important we have a European Union Act next March when these rules are brought in, that we do not just start downgrading the importance of events on Friday. What happened was very important; Britain vetoed whatever it vetoed, although I am not clear what exactly it vetoed. That means this arrangement is not necessitated by our membership of the European Union, which would be protected under the Constitution, rather it is an intergovernmental arrangement. Under what was proposed on Friday, the European Court of Justice would be given the status of an adjudicator on whether we had implemented fiscal responsibility rules in accordance with the document at constitutional or equivalent level. It seems we could only do this by way of a referendum and that we could not do it simply by amending legislation. I will challenge that aspect and I am sure I will not be first in the queue in the High Court if the Government decides to implement it without a referendum.

We have concerns about this issue. Senator Sean D. Barrett's notes set out the significant impact a 0.5% structural deficit target would have on the European economy. Officials must listen to those economists who were not listened to before and accept their advice.

We welcome and support the Bill on which we do not want a division. I urge the Minister of State to listen to this point and accept the Bill. Senator Sean D. Barrett must take his own counsel on the matter.