Thomas Byrne (Fianna Fail)

I thank the Cathaoirleach for allowing me to raise this matter on the Adjournment and I am grateful to the Minister, Deputy Phil Hogan, for his attendance. It is good that many senior Ministers come to the House to reply to Adjournment matters. I am anxious to put that on the record.

I raised this issue following the publication of the first progress report on the Croke Park agreement, the perceived savings accruing from that agreement and in light of an article on the front page of last weekend's Sunday Business Post. The article stated that while there are savings of almost €300 million, the net benefit to the State might be far less. The proposed Department of public expenditure and reform has not yet been legally established and the Minister does not have any legal powers, which is, perhaps, why he is not in the House tonight. That Department confirmed to the media that the figure of €289 million does not include the cost of retirements and increases in the Civil Service and public service pension bill.

Will the Minister confirm what is the net benefit to the State's finances of the Croke Park agreement over the past year and what is the cost of retirement lump sums and increases in the pensions bill as a consequence of the number of staff leaving the Civil Service and public service? Is there any chance that the amount of money saved by the Croke Park agreement over the past 12 months will be less than the amount of money set aside to pay retirement lump sums, which can rise to 150% of a person's final salary, and future pension entitlements? I do not seek to be critical of the agreement; I supported it and still do. My party, which I supported in Government, helped to implement the agreement. I am anxious that it should succeed as it is important and it provides opportunities for transformation, greater efficiency and greater value for money for the taxpayer.

We face a mammoth task in reducing the deficit; it must be our first priority. It is a challenge that should consume every Member of the Oireachtas and the only surprise is that it has not engaged the public in the same way political debates about the deficit do in the United States. If we do not reduce our deficit, our ability to grow and create jobs will be impaired. Throughout much of today in the Seanad we have discussed the need to be innovative if we are to create jobs. However, a cloud of deficit hanging over our country, people and businesses will surely destroy any hope of creating the jobs our citizens need. I hope that in the future the net value of savings from the Croke Park agreement will be published, rather than the gross figures. We must be realistic and very clear about the challenges we face.