Caít Keane (Fine Gael)

I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Brian Hayes, to the House. This is a very important issue. In Ireland, speaking about houses and land is close to everybody's heart. No one depicted better than John B Keane in "The Field" how important a field is to a person. Considering this, how much more important is one's house and home? I differentiate between house and home, as has the motion. All of the phrases in the motion depict "home owners" and not "property owners" or "speculative borrowers", who may own more than one home. We must concentrate on the motion as being about home owners in distress.

I listened to Senator MacSharry and I know by the way he spoke that he feels very strongly about this. None of us can claim we are not sorry for home owners who are in distress. Anybody with a heart must be sorry for them. However, we must ensure any regulations introduced will help home owners in distress but will also consider the bigger picture, as must the Government, in the parameters of the finance available.

I will now speak about the Scottish scheme being implemented, which is akin to schemes here. Senator Hayden mentioned the shared ownership scheme and if this scheme were extended to people in real distress, it would be a similar type of scheme. It is not only the Scottish people who thought of doing this; we in Ireland have the shared ownership scheme. The motion is asking the Government to propose to examine ways of dealing with the issue. It does not state we must do A, B or C immediately. It is only by collective thought, innovative thinking and examining the matter further that we will come up with the correct proposals. Perhaps the Scottish shared ownership scheme would not suit the Irish system. We might find a flaw or that Ireland is too different.

Under the RAS scheme, a local authority takes a house from a person and rents it at a defined rent for a certain amount of time. This scheme could be extended. There are innovative ways we could examine helping distressed mortgage holders. However, everything must be examined in the context of the finance available.

The Scottish scheme takes into consideration the financial capital of the person. Senators Hayden and others quoted statistics on how many home owners were in distress. However, what have not been quoted are statistics on financial capital. Senator D'Arcy spoke about people in two bedroom houses not wanting to see people who own castles being bailed out. Correct me if I am wrong, but we do not have statistics on the financial capital of the people in real distress. They may be in distress with regard to their home ownership, but they may have a Mercedes down the road which they could get rid of. There is something in the financial capital aspect which must definitely be taken into consideration. Debt forgiveness and home ownership versus property ownership and the option to trade down must be taken into consideration.

The programme for Government lists many matters being examined at present and perhaps the Minister of State will speak about them, but at the risk he will not I want to put them on the record of the House. These matters including increasing the length of the moratorium on the repossession of modest family homes where a family makes an honest effort to pay the mortgage, and that fast-tracking personal bankruptcy reform is needed to bring it into line with best international practice such as introducing a flexible discharge period for honest bankrupts. Senator Higgins referred to something similar.

Another measure is converting the Money Advice and Budgeting Service, MABS, into a strengthened personal debt management agency with strong legal powers. We all know the great work that MABS does and this is a very welcome proposal. The agency would support families making an honest effort to deal with their debts, including non-mortgage debt, and providing protection from creditors where appropriate so they have time to sort out their affairs. Often, people given extra time can sort out their affairs. The measures also include ensuring the mortgage interest to supplement supports families.