Rónán Mullen (Independent)

In the light of reports that the Government proposal involves the linkage of judges' pay with that of Oireachtas Members and other public servants, the concern I raised yesterday on judges' pay was related to the history of inappropriate encroachment on judicial independence. If the only permitted reduction in judges' pay was in the context of other public servants, including Oireachtas Members, specifically members of the Executive, facing similar cuts, it would have a chilling effect on any attempted interference with judicial independence.

Senator Ivana Bacik referred to the decision of the European Court of Human Rights in the ABC case. I add my voice to say that, whether there is an expert group, this is an issue that must be referred back to the people. The context is that Ireland has more to teach its European partners than it has to learn on the issue of abortion because we have honoured human rights in the true sense by protecting the life of the unborn, while also having the lowest maternal mortality rate in the world. It remains the case that we are not in any way required to legislate to give effect to the flawed Supreme Court decision of 1992; we need only remember that there was no proper medical evidence heard in that case and we can point to the increasing awareness of the possible psychiatric and psychological downsides of abortion. This is something that is increasingly adverted to in the literature. Ireland has a lot to say on the issue and if we have an expert group, the issue must be referred back to be considered by the elected representatives of the people. I mentioned yesterday the excellent work done by the late Brian Lenihan and the committee of which he was a member prior to the 2002 abortion referendum and it remains Ireland's position to determine its precise law on abortion. We cannot claim to be advocates of human rights, unless we protect life at all stages, and that means protecting life from conception, guaranteeing the best medical care to women during pregnancy, ensuring they do not feel they have no alternative but to have an abortion, and providing all the social supports necessary in order that they do not choose to have an abortion. That will be the test of our concern for human dignity and human rights.