Jim Walsh (Fianna Fail)

Tá mé buíoch don Seanadóir Ó Briain as ucht seans a thabhairt dom leabhairt ar an ábhar tábhachtach seo.

The former Tánaiste Dick Spring introduced water charges back in 1983 when he was Minister for the Environment. It was done on a flat rate basis and, as Senator Rónán Mullen pointed out, to address the fiscal difficulties of the time. I remember chairing the local authority in my own town when we had a majority on the council and we debated the issue because there were differences in Fianna Fáil about whether they should be supported. We came to a conclusion that the local authority needed the funding and that it was not unfair to apply water charges. I have not changed my mind since and I notice that Sinn Féin has not done so either. Shortly after we made the decision locally, Sinn Féin mounted a campaign against water charges. I remember attending one of its public meetings and when prevailed upon to make the case for the charges, I pointed out that the small cost involved - I think I said it would only cost the price of a glass of Smithwicks per week - was only a fraction of what we were charging for electricity. When I asked which utility people would choose in the event of an emergency where they had to do without one of them, most found it difficult to make the decision because they were both absolutely essential. I have not changed my mind since.

Water is a finite resource. It is not just a valuable resource; in fact, it is essential to sustaining human life. There is a need for conservation and to recognise, as many economists have pointed out, that it will be the oil of the future. We have a role to play in that respect.

Metering is a fairer way to charge for water. I was very disappointed with the contribution of the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government. He brought the contents of the EU-IMF agreement to our attention, but he did not go on to say whether the assessment required under the agreement had been undertaken. Has there been a cost benefit analysis of providing a meter system? According to one report, this will cost €500 million. What benefit will be derived from it? It would seem to have benefits, by way of encouraging people to conserve their water supply. However, no evidence has been advanced on whether any particular study has been conducted. In the situation in which we find ourselves we need to question any expenditure of that magnitude.

There has been no indication as to what the charge is likely to be. I note that Labour Party Members are seeking refuge in the fact that the Minister has stated that when the charge is introduced, it will be done on a metered basis. My prediction is that we will be faced with a household charge of some description on a flat rate basis which will be introduced from 1 January 2012. Whether it is in place as a water charge on an interim basis, or a property charge, or something else by another name, it will happen.

In the current climate we need to spread the tax base. My real view is that we must reduce public expenditure drastically. Fianna Fáil made an attempt to do this with some effect, but it did not go far enough. However, the attempt was not very popular with the public. I would be very concerned about the reaction of the Government to any unpopular measures in seeking to defend the interests of the parties, rather than the interests of the country.

What efficiencies have been identified by introducing a water company on a national basis? Will we end up with a semi-State body with average salaries of around €80,000 per annum and a chief executive paid in excess of €500,000, just like in the ESB? Will the cost escalate when compared with the cost of the local government operational system? How many redundancies will result at local government level? We need further debate on this issue. The Minister has skirted over the issues involved and there was no meat in what he had to say. We need to have a proper debate because the uncertainty is only going to cause resentment among consumers. Unless we develop consumer confidence and spending, the economy will stagnate for as long as that condition continues.