Dara Calleary (Mayo, Fianna Fail)

A number of Senators raised the issue of non-productive public servants and the number of such people who are hiding in the system. There are undoubtedly many poor public servants and we have been incredibly restricted to date as to how we deal with that and poor performance. Every person one speaks to has had a bad interaction with one, two or three public servants. Equally, however, there are many good people as well. Senator Keaveney made that point. I was in Inishowen a week after that tragic accident occurred. Public servants were the first people at the crash scene. They brought patients and the dead to the hospitals in Letterkenny. It was public servants who had the job of telling a parent their child was dead. Can any of us put ourselves in that situation? It is public servants who continue to deal with it. The media and everyone else has moved on to the next headline but the public servants are on the ground dealing with those families and with such unimaginable scenes. That is replicated throughout this country. It is important to realise that we place public servants in situations which we ourselves would not tackle or wish to tackle. With regard to those who let the public servant down, however, their days are numbered. We cannot allow poor performance to hide behind the good reputation of our service. We must make changes there and I agree with Senators in that regard.

Senator Quinn raised the issue of unions that oppose the deal. I have been clear on that. If one is opposing the implementation of change in the public service, one does not have the benefit of the protection in the deal. I reiterate to the unions that oppose the implementation of this deal that these are not hollow words. I am determined to see that through. It is unfair to christen all the teaching unions as Senator Mooney might have done inadvertently. The INTO has taken this agreement and run with it from the start. It cannot have been easy with the other two unions, although, in fairness, the ASTI has come on board. The general secretary of the INTO, Ms Sheila Noonan, serves on the implementation body. The INTO has taken the ball and run with it and I believe it is committed to seeing this process through.

Senator Mooney raised the issue of procurement. We are a doing a great deal of work on that. Procurement is very important in a number of areas. While we must get more value for money, something to which I am committed, equally however, spending that amount of money in public procurement is a way to create jobs. This summer we eased some of the regulations to allow smaller companies to access Government contracts and to remove the paperwork burden that cripples that process so those companies can sustain employment and create new jobs. It is important to do that.

Senators asked if there were too many public servants. That is a very broad issue and we might have that discussion on another occasion. However, the OECD, which does not necessarily hold back when it thinks there is a problem, said in its report that we are not over-staffed in comparison with our European neighbours. It should also be borne in mind that we reduced the number by approximately 11,000 in 18 months. There will be further reductions. On the next occasion I visit the House we can get into further discussion and detail about that.

Senator Twomey referred to some of the changes required such as technical changes in the health service in particular. I am sure the House will join with me in wishing Cathal Magee every success as he takes over as chief executive officer of the HSE. He has identified the need for large-scale IT projects and this will happen in a different environment with the appointment of our chief information officer and our shared services officer. This is an area about which I knew very little when I began this job but I have taken some time over the summer to look into shared services and IT generally. As Senator O'Malley said, there is significant potential in this area and it is an area to which I have a particular commitment.

I thank the House and the Senators and I thank the Acting Chairman for her good wishes. I have a personal commitment to this area. I share all of the frustrations that are being expressed about this House and the other House and the manner in which politics in general has lost much of its power and role over the past number of years. We are the people who are answerable for what happens. To those who think this agenda may change under different management I say "Dream on". A different management will have to make the same decisions-----