David Norris (Independent)

I am grateful to Senator Coffey for allowing me this time. I am especially pleased that Senator Mullen has tabled this motion, which is very important. The length and detail of the motion shows the complexity of the situation. I am glad to speak on this issue as I was asked to deliver the Mary Redmond Foundation lecture in February last at the St. Francis Hospice, which I did. It was a deeply religious and deeply spiritual place. I had a very interesting exchange of views with the people there and I agreed with them on most things because hospice care is very important.

There has been a huge cultural shift. A total of 30,000 people die in Ireland each year, nearly 80% of whom die in hospital, most of them in wards containing five or six people, which is not always appropriate. A friend of mine in my local area was married to a distinguished artist who died after being taken to the casualty department of a hospital. She was told her partner was dead and was brought into the room where the hospital staff tried to resuscitate him. Eventually, they produced a priest who had no idea who this man was and referred to his wife as his daughter. Two orderlies then appeared who did not know who she was and who were laughing and joking. There was a complete lack of dignity; it was extraordinary. This person wrote an article in The Irish Times stating that no one present had any training in how to deal with someone who is suddenly bereaved.

Hospitals do not do death. They see it as a failure and not as a natural thing that happens. That is the difference with a hospice. Many have spoken of their personal experience. I have had personal experience, although I do not have the time to put it on the record. There has been a huge cultural shift. A total of 80% of people now die in hospitals whereas at the beginning of the 20th century it was only 20%. We are very lucky to have a hospice movement and it is very important we do.

I compliment Senator Feeney, who I heard from my office talk about the death of her father. She said she wished for him to have certain treatments involving the application of pain controlling drugs but this was forbidden under some ethical consideration because it would lead directly to his death. Why not? What arrogance and impertinence for outsiders - third parties - to consider they had the right to dictate the manner of death, the most intimate, personal moment of any person's life.

I recognise there is a difficulty. I read with great interest the statement from the Roman Catholic hierarchy in Britain which referred to the dangers of giving too much pain control. They made one very interesting point. The patient should be consulted because sometimes pain control interferes with the patient's capacity to deal with their family and friends. If the family, friends and person wish for this, they should be allowed that capacity.

We need to know what is a good or happy death. Perhaps the Minister of State knows the story, A Happy Death, by one of our greatest artists, the late Mary Lavin. A British woman had mistreated her husband who was a dreamer. When the man collapsed and was taken to hospital, the woman did not know what to do. She saw some of the other patients were having fruit delivered, so she got fruit, chocolates and magazines. The man was beyond it. There was blaspheming and screaming from the next ward but suddenly it stopped. One of the nuns came in and said was it not wonderful that God had vouchsafed this man, this blasphemer, a happy death. The woman thought that was it, she would get him a happy death. She got priests, rosaries and all the rest. She came up to him and whispered an act of contrition into his ear, saying she was heartily sorry. He woke up and said he was not a bit sorry, that it was wonderful, that he always loved her and that it was worth it. The woman went away grieving because God had not given her husband a happy death. What an irony. Of course, he had a happy death. That is what the hospice movement so wonderfully helps us to give to our fellow citizens.