Lisa McDonald (Fianna Fail)

Nobody is suggesting the Minister is going easy on fraud. In fact, the opposite is the case. I support his notion that a change in the structure would be far better, rather than sending out inspectors to stumble on incidents of fraud. The Minister's example of back kitchen extensions is a good one. Perhaps if we had helicopters flying around the place, we would notice some of them. Self-declaration of works might be the way forward. The Minister mentioned the introduction of an identity card and the giving of PPS numbers, all of which will assist in the crack down on fraud. Change in the structure is important. If a system is not defrauded or challenged easily, people will be far more compliant, as happens in all walks of life.

I know as a practising solicitor that often during the Celtic tiger years banks did not look for insurance from solicitors when sending in requisitions for cheques. They do now.

In the same way perhaps the banks should request the PPS numbers, the insurance certificates and the C2 certificates of the builders. There is widespread abuse at the lower end of the construction trade in terms of people claiming and so on, but the best idea to which I heard the Minister refer was that self-employed people should be immediately subject to the activation rule because they can contribute. There are many examples of that. We see with NAMA, for example, and many other cases where people in the self-employed trade could and should offer something in terms of payment. There is much sense in what the Minister said. I fully support his efforts to bring that to fruition and I hope we will see it soon.