Liam Twomey (Fine Gael)

One interesting aspect to a debate on the BAI is it shows the way broadcasting works in Ireland at this time. We have broadcasting at a local level and at a multimedia macro level and in effect we are trying to make both types fit into the same space. That is not really possible, however.

I do not believe local radio stations need to be as over-regulated as they are. They are not purely profit-driven, and have a socio-economic role. They must be in touch with the communities they serve in a way that is different to other media outlets. To some degree local radio stations self-regulate themselves. If they are not playing the appropriate songs or covering local news listeners will simply switch to another station. Occasionally they may push the boundaries, but if presenters are offensive, the public will rein them in. We have seen that happen with the national broadcaster as much as we have at local level.

To some degree the BAI could conceivably metamorphose into a quango. Its officials will be looking at an hour's programming, for instance, parsing every word that was said and deciding how much of the programme is music, news, chat and whatever. There is no need for such a restrictive BAI. I believe that local stations will operate well within the spirit of the law and there is no need for an organisation to be overseeing them in this manner.

Perhaps it is different as regards multimedia and other media outlets across the country, because basically these can come from anywhere. The Internet has dramatically changed the way we approach multimedia. It can present one with anything. One can get any type of programme that suits one's tastes on the Internet, and this is literally true. There is no way to monitor that. For instance, as regards what has been said about children's advertising and restrictions on what may be pushed at children, this should be the subject of a European directive. There should be a European broadcasting authority to monitor what is going on, because we have no way of stopping stuff coming from France, England, Germany or wherever. If we believe that just restricting RTE, TV3, and TG4 will make any difference, it will not, and will fail.

I was very interested to hear what Senator Harris had to say, namely, that fairness was different to balance. That should be a core point as regards what the BAI does because it is correct. If one tries to get balance in every single programme, one can mess up the message. If one is trying to highlight what happened as regards ghost housing developments, for example, or a specific part of economic activity over the last couple of years, and one is circumscribed by the necessity to achieve balance all the way through, one can mess it up. If RTE spent all its time making anti-Government programmes - news, current affairs or whatever - the Government would automatically have a strong case. However, I assure the Minister of State that we on this side of the House often feel we are getting a raw deal from RTE and other national broadcasters.

What has happened is that after 13 years of growth and relatively good news, Fianna Fáil has become overly sensitive to bad news and criticism. If we analyse the programmes of the national broadcaster we will see it tries as much as possible to be fair. That is the point that should be made to the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland - the need for fairness at all times - and not this nonsensical stuff about balance. It just will not work; people will switch off.

Everybody is trying to manipulate news globally. One can transmit news from the mountains of Afghanistan to the world via the Internet. How can we restrict how the news is delivered in a First World country such as this, in which people have ready access to the Internet, mobile phones and terrestrial and satellite television? It would be a waste of time. How would the Minister of State consider restricting access to certain programmes? It cannot be done. Twenty years ago, if people wanted to obtain pornography in this country they would have had some difficulty; now it is available at the click of a mouse. If one types the word "pornography" into a search engine, there are 25 million results. How can this be restricted? It cannot be. The only way for a parent such as myself to restrict my children's access to the Internet is to install a program such as Net Nanny. There are plenty of opportunities for children to access unbelievable content on the Internet. Rather than taking the North Korean attitude and attempting to block it all, it is a question of teaching people more about what they get from the media, how to interpret stories, and how to deal with their perception of the information they are receiving.

There are some people in the House who would love to see the highlights of the Order of Business during the first three minutes of the six o'clock news, but unfortunately that will never work. For some reason, it just will not interest the majority of people. We must think more realistically about what is actually happening.

In the future we will see more niche television stations springing up on the Internet. Production will improve and become more professional, but there will be a focus on niche areas. To some degree this is already happening with digital and satellite television, but such stations will become much more obtainable over the Internet.

I ask the Minister of State the reasoning behind the Minister's idea of making the Heineken Cup available on free-to-air television stations. There is a need for clarity in this regard because there is a possible conflict of interest. The Heineken Cup has always been available on RTE because agreements have always been made with the national broadcaster, even though the rugby authorities could have gone somewhere else. This means the national broadcaster must pay for the Heineken Cup, and the money it pays goes towards the development of professional and amateur rugby in this country. Now the Minister, who is also responsible for funding RTE, has suddenly managed to save it a substantial amount of money by making this decision. One can see the conflict of interest that exists.

I would like the Minister to make a statement on this. There will be a significant impact on the development of rugby as a sport. The IRFU is saying there will be an impact on the professionalism and high standards of the sport, that if Irish clubs are not in the Heineken Cup any more then no one will be watching it anyway, and that this will have an impact on amateur rugby, which has developed magnificently across the country over the last number of years.