Paul Bradford (Fine Gael)

I welcome the Minister and thank him for being present. I and many of my colleagues on both sides of the House have sought this debate for a number of months because we recognise, as the Minister fully does, the importance of this debate, the necessity of getting, in so far as is possible, a broad consensus on what the Irish negotiating position should be and to try to succeed at Brussels level, first, in securing sufficient funding for Irish agriculture and, second, in attempting, and it is to be hoped succeeding, to distribute that funding in the fairest possible way.

The Minister spoke in his concluding remarks about the need for Ireland to speak coherently, with which I very much agree. That is the reason it is necessary to achieve some balance and consensus in our approach. The Minister spoke about the need to do so with a unified voice. While it would be pleasant if we could achieve this quickly and effectively, it is, perhaps, not possible to do so. We must be realistic, given the range of views, opinions, choices and alternatives being presented, not alone by farming organisations but also countrywide. On this occasion we need to listen to everybody. The loudest and strongest voice is not always correct. It is important the Minister is in a position to take with him to Brussels an overview of the thinking of every farmer and farm family on these proposals and how they wish to see him representing their views and concerns.

On where we should be attempting to move to, I suggest we should be seeking what I describe as the blessed trinity of the three Fs - food production, food quality and farm families. That is what this debate should be about and what we should aspire to achieve. We must be able to assure not alone the people of Ireland but also the people of the European Union that the package, when agreed, be it in 2011 or 2012, will secure adequate food production on the continent of Europe, that it will be food of the highest possible quality - it is imperative in today's environment that food is of the highest quality - and, from an Irish perspective, that we will put in place an agreement that will keep farm families active and as the cornerstone of Irish agriculture.

The one dramatic change on the agricultural map of Ireland since our joining the European Union in 1973 has been the huge reduction in the number of farm families. In a sense, this is part of the price of progress. I can safely say that when I entered politics, there were a number of dairy farmers in every townland. Now there is possibly only one in most townlands. If this trend continues, we will arrive at a situation in ten, 15 or 20 years time where there will be only one dairy farmer in each parish. The same applies to beef farmers and the tillage sector. Pig farmers have almost disappeared, while the sheep sector is under pressure, notwithstanding the arrangements the Minister recently put in place. We must aim high in attempting to ensure we maintain as far as possible the highest number of farm families.

When attempting to sell and defend the concept of the Common Agricultural Policy, it is necessary that we reflect a little on from where it has come. The policy was put in place on the continent of Europe in the aftermath of the Second World War when the population of western Europe was virtually starving. It was a time when there was not enough food being produced for the tables of Europe. The primary purpose of the original policy was to give to the peoples of Europe a solemn commitment that they would never again suffer food shortages. In this regard, the policy has been a success. Since its introduction, there has been an abundant supply of food across the Continent. We have also been able to produce a surplus amount which we have been able to export, creating jobs in the process.

There is a fallacy which dominates some of the debate in the press on the Common Agricultural Policy in terms of the cost of supports for agriculture. When one reflects on the fact that the cost of the policy amounts to approximately 0.5% of the entire GDP of the European Union, one can submit extraordinary value for money is being obtained. We are putting on the tables of Europe food of the highest quality and safest standards at a competitive price. Today the average family spend on food as compared with that in 1973 when Ireland joined the European Union is significantly less on a percentage basis of family income. The Irish and European consumer is getting excellent value as a result of the farming policies put in place under the policy which has secured food supply and assures us that there will be no food shortages in Europe, all of which is done at minimal cost to the European taxpayer. The big spin-off, notwithstanding the disappointing drop in the number of farm families, is that farming in this country and across the continent of Europe continues to employ tens of thousands, perhaps millions, of people. The spin-off in the agri-industry is enormous. This is what the Minister and his colleagues must focus on as they continue to debate the future funding of European agriculture.

That the European Parliament will have a significant role in the negotiating process creates a new political arena. Traditionally, in the negotiations at the Council Prime Ministers and Ministers for Agriculture make arrangements in smoke-filled back rooms. That was how business was conducted and how politics and European arrangements were decided. Now, under the more transparent political system put in place as a result of the Lisbon treaty, the European Parliament will co-decide how agriculture is to be funded in the future. This presents significant new opportunities and challenges, as it is no longer a question of satisfying 27 Ministers and Prime Ministers but of reaching an agreement that will garner the support of almost 800 MEPs from the west of Ireland to the Urals. It will be a difficult task to put together a package that will satisfy all contrasting demands. I appreciate, therefore, that the Minister is facing a serious task, in regard to which we want to work with him. My colleague, Deputy Creed, stated in the other House that this was a green jersey issue, on which we will all work with and for the Minister to secure the best possible deal for Ireland.

Fine Gael has held a number of public meetings across the country on the issues involved. I held such a meeting in Fermoy a number of weeks ago and was pleased when hundreds of people turned up to listen to outside speakers discuss the various options. Another meeting was held in Charleville on Monday night, to which the same applied. Farmers and farm families are anxious to part-take in the debate, offer their views and hear the Minister's. The Minister is facing a serious challenge, but there are also opportunities and choices. Unfortunately, however, we will not be able to arrive at a solution that will make everybody happy, as there are many strands of opinion across the country on direct payments, reference years, allowing new entrants into agriculture and modulation, all of which are tough issues, in respect of which it will undoubtedly not be possible to make everybody happy. We must ask ourselves what should be our aspirations and what funding and programmes should be achieved at the end of the negotiations. As I stated, it is crucial that the issues of food quality and production and the retention of farm families remain top of the agenda.

How does one travel this journey? The historical payments system is supported by many of our constituents who benefit from it and wish to see it retained. The Minister has couched his language in terms of his thinking on the issue. I am aware that his official position and, to the best of my knowledge, that of Fine Gael is that we should fight to retain the current system. However, we must be realistic and truthful. It appears Commissioner Ciolos and many others have indicated that the current system and payment method are not alone up for review but also change. If that is the political message from Brussels and a decision in this regard has already been made at that level, we will need to show flexibility in the policies we advocate.

Our first task - it will be a major one - is to secure the strongest possible national envelope of money. If my figures are correct, we benefit from a sum of approximately €1.5 billion per annum in direct payments and approximately €1.8 billion in total. Our bottom line must be that we secure that level of funding. We must also concern ourselves with the political pressure being applied to introduce co-financing which we must strongly resist because we know our economic situation is far from being as strong as we would wish it to be. We know in regard to the REPS and other EU programmes under which co-funding is required, we may not be in a position to submit the matching funds. Co-funding of agricultural grants and support mechanisms could be disastrous for Ireland and in so far as is humanly possible we have to try to keep away from it.

I need not tell the Minister that step one is to maximise the budget, which will be difficult. The politics of the issue with the input of MEPs could pose certain problems in that regard. I take some consolation from a recent survey of public opinion conducted throughout Europe which indicated that the view of farming and farm families and the need to support farmers under the Common Agricultural Policy was at an all-time high on the continent of Europe. There was a time in the late 1970s and 1980s when the concept of funding for agriculture was seen as a big negative at European level and there was a wrong impression that virtually all European funds were going towards supporting agriculture. Now the European consumer knows better and the value of the European taxpayer's investment. It is significant that this Europe-wide poll showed very strong support for a continuation of the assistance made available to agriculture. I hope this will make slightly easier our task of trying to secure the strongest possible national envelope. Once it has been secured - I hope it will at least be at the current level - we must discuss distribution. Support must be maximised for those actively engaged in farming, particularly farm families. We must also ask ourselves what we can do to assist those who, owing to being in the wrong place at the wrong time, do not benefit from historical payments. What about farm families who receive virtually no assistance and may have a son or daughter who wishes to carve out a future in Irish agriculture for himself or herself? This issue must also be examined.

At some meetings I attended a minimum payment was mentioned. Controversially, a maximum payment has also been mentioned. It is very easy to receive a strong round of applause at a public meeting when one speaks about the amounts received by the Queen of England, Larry Goodman or Greencore. Millions can go in cheques to individuals or groups such as these.

There appears to be radio interference by the Kilkenny world service and Senator John Paul Phelan at the back-----