Mark Dearey (Green Party)

It has been interesting to listen to the contributions of Senators in the legal profession speak about their experience of how the system works downstream of the law. I wish to make a brief contribution on my experience as a councillor in recent times.

The Bill will be welcomed the length and breadth of Ireland by councillors who continually have to deal with very distressed individuals who for relatively minor offences finding themselves, with their families and individual reputations, embroiled in what is a terrible ordeal, even if it only involves a trip to Mountjoy Prison for half a day and back home again. Many have undeservedly had to go through this ordeal and the matter falls into the laps of working councillors who must make representations about such cases. Not only is the courts system being clogged up but the local government system can also find itself snowed under. In that context and in the context of general equity and the degree to which understanding and compassion have been expressed, I welcome the Bill in broad and specific terms. However, I take Senator Bacik's point about the €100 minimum figure, below which instalment payments are not possible. There are cases in which such a form of payment should be considered.

For my own purposes, I have listed the main points of the Bill under the three headings, each beginning with the letter "i", the first of which is "indexation". I listened to Senator Regan and take him at his word that it is subtle and responsive, as I have not yet managed to unpick it. The second heading is "instalment payments" is the second, while the third is "imprisonment alternatives". That is my mnemonic for working through the Bill.

The Irish Penal Reform Trust, the stated goal of which is to campaign for the rights of everyone involved in the penal system, with prison being a last resort, has also welcomed the Bill. The notion that prison should be seen as the point of last resort lies at the heart of how the Bill will be applied. I welcome the fact that community service orders and the seizure of goods are interim measures before the final step will be taken. I presume this will only happen if a person refuses rather than is unable to pay a fine.

From the point of view of the Green Party, the Bill is progressive and in line with our policy of pursuing alternatives to custody. It is also an agreed item between the two parties in government in the revised programme for Government and, in that context, is to be welcomed.

We can learn from the experience of successful penal reform systems in countries such as Finland, Germany and Canada, in which a conscious decision was made to reduce the prison population through the implementation of programmes of community alternatives to custody. The Bill provides a perfect example of how this can work, whereby people can be diverted from a custodial sentence or a visit to prison for a day which can be highly disruptive. The Green Party is committed to bringing about this kind of change and, as such, is happy to support the Bill.

I refer to Senator McDonald's contribution. The Law Reform Commission proposed the establishment of a central debt enforcement office to divert many of these cases away from the courts. Having listened to Senator Bacik's descriptions of the clogged-up system, I suggest this proposal might be worthy of consideration and one which the Green Party would support. Such an approach would offer a quicker and cheaper non-judicial debt settlement process which would distinguish between those who will not pay and those who cannot pay. Those who will not pay should always remain exposed to the ultimate threat of imprisonment.

We have one worry in the area of fines imposed for breaches of environmental regulations. Sometimes those who breach such regulations are willing to pay a fine on successive occasions. There is a need for a mechanism, whereby this can be recognised. Some people work in the shadier parts of the economy - the black economy. Particularly for those involved in the smuggling of diesel and fuel the imposition of a fine is not a deterrent. I do not want to think the Bill might make life easier for these larriers and cowboys.

I welcome the Bill which I am happy to support.