Joe O'Toole (Independent)

We are indebted to Senators Donohoe and Twomey on this issue. This is the kind of thinking we need in industry. In 1492, Columbus set out from Spain to find the Indies, as he thought, and he discovered the great continent of America, by accident. Many of the great developments have happened as a result of serendipity, finding something by accident. The best example is the discovery of penicillin; they were looking for something else and discovered it by accident in the stuff they had thrown outside the back door. This is similar and fits well with the Irish psyche. Where I come from, there was always someone who owned a steelworks. If something broke and it was obsolete or no longer available, he would say he would make something up. He filled the gap with an intellectual bridge from the obsolete to the useful. That fits the Irish psyche.

There is a design competition every year in Britain and it interests me because I like the simplicity of great creations. A student who was working on something else, using his slim Apple MacBook, noticed that he was using an awkward, large three pin plug that is a real pain when travelling abroad. He asked himself why he was using such a big plug when his computer was less than half an inch thick. He stopped what he was doing, looked at the plug anew and developed a collapsable plug that fitted beside his computer. It won the design competition.

How is that relevant? It is precisely the point Senator Donohoe is making. People are focused on a core objective and along the way must create new strategies to reach it. In doing so they create something outside their core work. In business the norm is to focus on the core and not spread out when ones risks losing focus. The idea brought forward by Senator Donohoe - that spin-off ideas can be used - should be considered. There are those who say such ideas distract us from the main job; therefore, a parallel sub-company could be established for an idea to be transferred in such a way that, according to the amendment, there would be no capital gains arising from the transfer and the new spin off company would be able develop the product while claiming the research relief for what was done for whatever length of time.

Why is this important? During the boom Ministers spoke about the need for investment in research and development. I do not know how many times I was in negotiations with the social partners when we pleaded with people to get involved in research and development. In fairness, IBEC did the same. However, people were too busy making money; they did not need to waste their time on research and development that would take too long to show a return. Therefore, they did not focus on it. Now, however, there is spare intellectual capacity in the country and these ideas are still coming through. They have intellectual added value, with a job creation focus. In business terms, we are talking about a near-market idea that needs incubation and marketing, skills that might not be available in the core company which discovered the possibility at the earlier stage. We have a duty, therefore, to encourage and develop this idea.

I cannot see how we could object to this. I already know what the Minister of State will say. I keep saying this to his officials who are the crème de la crème of the Civil Service, but they are afraid to take a chance. The Minister of State should stroll over to the Department of the Taoiseach to say he has made his first decision, that he has decided to accept an amendment and will argue to back it up. He will be a better man for it and his officials will be able to say they did the State some service this week.

We are looking for the encouragement about which Ministers talk every day. This is an idea that has come from the milieu the Minister of State is trying to develop. These topics come up in conversation regularly, when someone tells us he or she is working on something new and we are curious about the problem he or she might face and how to solve it. People talk about politics being confrontational and negative but this is completely positive; there is no downside, and there would be no loss to the Government in accepting it.

This is no longer a manufacturing country of real note and never will be again; therefore, we must become involved in other aspects of manufacturing. This covers one such aspect. Another is the management of manufacturing in order that we manage it from Ireland while a product is manufactured elsewhere, creating jobs in the ideas field here. There are ways by which we can go about doing this. Is there anything more valuable than a good idea? The answer is no. This is a good idea the Minister of State could make happen; one word would do it: "Yes". He should try it and he will get a great sense of satisfaction. Also, his officials would never let him out on his own anymore and he would always have help beside him.

This is the sort of development we must encourage. I know what the Minister of State will say in reply, but he must remember the discussions we had in Belmullet when we were looking at the development of industry in the area. The county manager, the Minister of State and I discussed building a 500 megawatt power generating station in Bellacorrick and connecting to the grid. The Minister of State's attitude that night would allow him to take this on board.