John Paul Phelan (Fine Gael)

While I welcome most of what the Minister of State said, a difficulty that arises is that the individual concerned had an agreed contract with his former employers who provided major employment in Waterford city in the south eastern region but who are now no longer in existence. The possibility that the scheme, of which this individual is a member, would pay a supplementary bridging pension does not and will not arise for him.

While I welcome that the Minister of State indicated in the last paragraph of his reply that a person can apply for another social welfare payment in the intervening period, that is not a good enough answer. I acknowledge that the Minister of State is not the Minister responsible for this Department but if this pension framework is to work, that line must be much stronger and there must be a firm commitment from the Department of Social and Family Affairs that a mechanism will be put in place for the very small number of people who will find themselves in this position with potentially devastating consequences in terms of their household income. The income of the individual to whom I refer will fall to €100 a week and there is also the question of the introduction of means-testing to which his wife's part-time job might be subject. The Minister of State said that: "A person can apply for another social welfare payment in any intervening period". I want him to convey to the Department of Social and Family Affairs that this provision needs to be firmed up and clarified if the pension framework is to work. I do not have a problem with the pension framework. The pension time-bomb has been referred to in this House and most people acknowledge it. However, for the specific people in occupational pension schemes of businesses that are not in a position to top up those schemes and to give those people that extra allowance for the 12 or 24-month period, the position of the Department of Social and Family Affairs must be clear in terms of ensuring that top-up is made.