Rónán Mullen (Independent)

The reason it has resonated with the people is that the people cannot have confidence in a Chamber whose Members they have no part in electing. There is a credibility problem with the Seanad; it does not fit in with the spirit of the times owing to its electoral system.

I accept what Senator Brady said. It is true France has a system of les grands électeurs who are representatives of the conseils régionalaux and others who elect Senators. However, that does not make it right. I strongly support what has been said by other speakers and what is contained in the 2004 report, that there should be direct election. I believe the report proposed that 32 Senators be directly elected by the people.

Much of the other criticism that applies to the Seanad also applies to the Dáil. We have a weak parliamentary system. There is huge need for reform in order that legislators actually get to be legislators. Examples were given of occasions when legislators in this House managed to point out something which the Government took on board, but we could do a great deal better than this. Yesterday there was a dramatic development in American politics with the loss of the Democrat seat in Massachusetts to the Republican Party candidate. When Ted Kennedy died, everybody remarked that he was a great legislator. The reason he was able to be a great legislator was that Congress in the American system had power; the President of the United States must horse trade with the elected representatives in the Senate and the House of Representatives. That can lead to problems; it will certainly pose problems for the health reforms President Obama is trying to get through Congress. However, at least it makes legislators what they should be, people who can take an active and sustained interest in legislation and policy. They are motivated to do so because they know they can have an impact and legislate for the good of their country. In Ireland we need to get to that position, sooner or later. That is not just a matter for Senators, it is also a matter for Deputies. Everybody knows there are some tremendously talented Deputies and Senators who give very little of their intellectual space to legislation and policy because they must first mind their constituencies. We need reform and a more thorough debate about all these matters, not just superficial change or sniping at the Seanad.

I very much regret that the Minister, Deputy Gormley, appears to be pulling back from a commitment he gave earlier. On the last occasion this issue was debated at the behest of Senator O'Toole, the Minister gave a commitment that a wider pool of graduates - I believe that is the phrase he used - would take part in the election of the six university Senators. Today he has said the university Senators do not want the university seats to be reformed in isolation. I dissent from this. We should not wait another day before carrying out what was mandated in the 1979 referendum. On my first day in the Seanad I told Members I did not want to have the embarrassment at the next election of meeting graduates whose degrees were as good as mine but who could not take part in the election of Senators because of an out-of-date system. That is the easiest part of reform to carry through.

There should be a single six-seat constituency in order that all university or college graduates would be on an equal footing in terms of the measure of representation available to them in the Seanad. It is no argument to contend that it would be an impossibly large constituency of voters. I believe the Minister quoted the figure of 500,000 voters. That is the same size as a European Parliament constituency. It can and needs to be done. Just because it is not the only reform needed does not mean we should not proceed with it. That said, if we should move to a system of direct election of Senators by citizens, we could also move to a system under which the entire process could be carried out on election day and not by postal vote. That would also deal with the problem to which the Minister referred.

I commend the work done by graduates of other colleges during the years, particularly by the organisation Graduate Equality, to achieve some movement on this issue. The announcement by the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Batt O'Keeffe, of the proposed abolition of the NUI, a matter we will have to debate separately, could create complications for reforming the election of university Senators, but that reform must happen and not be delayed. I hope the Minister, Deputy Gormley, finds support for it in the Cabinet and takes the initiative sooner rather than later.