Larry Butler (Fianna Fail)

I disagree totally with the idea that the Government squandered money. It has a good record and the infrastructure that has been built in this country over the past ten years is exemplary. No Government would be ashamed of the way the money was spent. The evidence is in the budget.

It is important to bear in mind that those on social welfare have a difficult life. They do not take many holidays and they do not enjoy many nights out during the week. They live on the minimum. I appreciate that the Minister had a difficult budget. With a budget of €21 million for those on social welfare it is important that she did what she did to ensure old people and those on fixed incomes and pensions were not affected. I refer to the facilities these people still have.

I was invited to the turning on of the lights at Graiguenamannagh, with 500 to 600 people in attendance, and I reject what Senator McFadden said. Very few people really objected to the budget. They thought it was quite fair. I also attended a dinner for 300 senior citizens in Kilkenny. I spoke at that function and spoke to people at the tables after the meal. I got a good reception and people felt they were making some contribution, whatever little they could. These people have gone through bad times and recessions during their lifetimes. It was right that when the Minister had a difficult budget to introduce, these people were protected.

It is important to get our young people out of the social welfare system. In the 1980s, particularly in parts of Dublin, families never saw their father or mother working. This created a terrible situation for young people. I employed one young man who told me that the family was laughing at him going to work. I could not believe it. He told me he had never seen anyone in his house working. He was the first man in his house to work. I applaud the Minister for trying to get people working. It should not be the case that those on social welfare are better off than those working. We are sending out the wrong message is if we do that although we must support those who are not working.

The Joint Committee on Social and Family Affairs, particularly Deputies Thomas Byrne and Enright and I, produced a report. We were asked to examine mortgages. Many people will be in difficulty with mortgages. The six-month moratorium was extended to 12 months but this does not extend across the banking sector. There is an opportunity for us to introduce amendments to the Bill to take certain steps. A moratorium of two years without penalties is important where two people in the household have lost their jobs and cannot make repayments at this stage. This will give them an opportunity to get back into training or employment. An insurance scheme to protect mortgages should be a three-way situation whereby the mortgage holder pays a sum, the lender pays a sum and the Government makes a contribution. We are contributing approximately €60 million under the mortgage interest supplement scheme. The insurance system I have advocated would work much better than this. If a small amount of approximately €15 was paid in insurance in the first year, with €5 being paid by the householder, the lender and the Government, it would bring in a sum of between €75 million and €100 million in a full year. If the amount was a little more than this, a fund of between €300 million and €400 million could be collected over two or three years. It would be important to use such a fund to assist those who drop out of work and whose mortgages are affected by unemployment. We should also introduce a rental scheme to cater for people who cannot afford to repay their mortgages. Similarly, banks should be able to acquire equity of between 25% and 30% in certain houses.

The three or four important measures I have mentioned are elaborated on in a report that I asked Mr. Fergus Murphy of the EBS to compile. This is not some pie in the sky idea I came up with. It has been well researched by the EBS which believes the system in question would be very bankable. I ask the Minister to consider what we can do to help the vulnerable people concerned. Whereas the rents of those living in public housing will decrease, the people about whom I speak have no protection. Some of the lenders not covered by the bank guarantee scheme are creating major problems for those who are in difficulty. It is important for us to take the action I have recommended.

I do not want to be negative. I honestly believe my party has a fine record of protecting people on low incomes, social welfare and pensions. The Minister for Social and Family Affairs, Deputy Hanafin, has done an excellent job in difficult circumstances. One would want to be Solomon to get a result better than she has achieved.