Feargal Quinn (Independent)

I am delighted this debate is taking place and to have the opportunity to contribute to it. Approximately three years ago I was on Ryan Tubridy's television show, "Tubridy Tonight". There was an interesting debate and towards the end of the show he asked me whether I would go back into the supermarket business if I was starting out in business now. I said "No" and that I believed there must be a huge future in renewable energy. I said it off-the-cuff but what surprised and delighted me in the following few weeks was the number of letters and contacts I received from people involved in various efforts to create renewable energy from wind, wave, solar and other sources. They were from all around Ireland. There was clearly an interest in it so I examined the issue of investing in renewable energy.

It is interesting to examine the attitude of the major multinationals who have invested in green energy and how they perceive the future of dealing with climate change. Perhaps the private sector's view of dealing with climate change should be taken account of as an indicator when considering the best ways to deal with the problem. BP's investment in renewable energy will fall from $1.4 billion in 2008 to less than $1 billion this year. It is reducing the amount of its investment. The company is selling some of its renewable energy assets, including three wind farms in India, and has cut its solar cell manufacturing capacity in Spain and America. The one renewable energy source it still appears to be serious about is bio-fuels. Royal Dutch Shell's strategy towards renewable energy has also changed. Earlier this year, the company, rated the largest corporation in the world by Fortune magazine in 2009, announced it would no longer invest in renewable energy projects such as wind, solar and hydro power projects because they were not economic.

The bottom line is that many investors seem to be scared off by the so-called "green future" and one must ask why that is so. The recession has had an effect and the start-up costs for such projects are higher than for conventional power projects. However, we must also realise that people are very sceptical about paying higher prices for so-called greener products. In my business I found there was always a core group of people who were willing to pay a higher price for certain products, be they free of genetic modification, organic or just greener.

People in Ireland and throughout the world see governments pushing so-called carbon taxes. They know that for all the guilt pushed on them, they will end up paying higher energy costs. It is the last thing Ireland needs at present. Our electricity and heating costs are among the highest in the EU, although I am aware that Bord Gáis has announced that the price of gas will decrease. However, we must do our utmost to bring these costs down so we can become competitive again. The single challenge we face is making ourselves competitive and while people are worried about the environment, they do not wish to be taken for mugs.

There are many questions to be answered, especially with regard to carbon tax. An indication of the customer's sceptical outlook about the environment in the midst of a recession is offered by what happened in British Airways. That airline has offered carbon offsets with its flights for the past four years but has found that only 3% of customers buy them. The Economist has put it bluntly. It commented last week that: "Attempts to get a renewable-energy industry going have flopped." Mr. Richard Tol, who writes on Ireland for that newspaper, has said that "renewable energy is more expensive than non-renewable energy and stimulating renewable energy therefore reduces competitiveness and slows down economic growth and job creation".

Instead of following the Green Party mantra of creating jobs through a green revolution, perhaps we should examine more closely current ways of creating jobs, which is what we really need at present. There will be grave difficulties if we attempt to move so quickly in the green area that we become uncompetitive. Perhaps a tax credit should be introduced for those who create jobs in any industry, as the US is now considering. What is certain is that we must examine new ways to get private business to invest in green energy. I am not sure how that will be done. It is not as easy as some people claim, especially in the Green Party. The New Scientist magazine pointed out earlier this year that "the most advanced "renewable" technologies are too often based upon non-renewable resources". In other words, the green lobby could be robbing the planet of irreplaceable natural assets.

However, I am hopeful for the future of renewable energies. When we finalise the amount of emissions our economy will reduce over the coming years, the move to renewable energies will become more incentivised. I hope we can move further in that direction. There is much work to be done because this issue is not nearly as simple as I thought it might be.

With regard to the legitimacy of climate change, it is obvious that the climate is changing but there has been an interesting discussion prior to the Copenhagen summit about the major cause of this change. It is difficult to know. Whether it is mainly man-made or something else is still debated. James Lovelock, in his most recent book published earlier this year, The Vanishing Face of Gaia, says the Earth's system is so complex and interconnected that "we are like a 19th century physician trying to give a sensible prognosis to a patient with diabetes".

Anybody who is interested in this topic should look up Easter Island on the Internet. It is fascinating to see what happened there. When the island was discovered 3,000 km to the west of Chile in the 16th century, it was inhabited by approximately 10,000 people. There was a thriving civilisation but by 1900 there were 100 people left. The people kept cutting down the trees and ruined the environment. Whoever chopped down the last tree should have known it would be the end for their civilisation. They did not survive. If one looks up the subject on the Internet, it will take only ten minutes to read about Easter Island. I have never been there. My daughter went to Chile and convinced me of the island's interest when I visited her there but we never managed to visit it. I would love to visit it sometime and see the huge statutes. It was the building of those statues that probably caused the end of the island's civilisation.

Perhaps humans do not react quickly enough or are not clever enough to handle what is approaching in the future. The Kyoto Agreement was reached 11 years ago and it is evident that discussions at Copenhagen are experiencing difficulties. They have only started but, at this stage, it does not appear that anything will be achieved. What worries me is that dissenting voices about the cause of climate change are branded deniers, sceptics and so forth. I am glad the scandal at the University of East Anglia's climatic research unit has brought the subject into focus in recent weeks. There were many headlines about that and it is useful to see what happened there. There are many legitimate views which are, to a degree, stifled. We must not suppress scientific debate on this matter.

With regard to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, IPCC, it could be said that it had already arrived at an opinion before any debate occurred. It is a political rather than a scientific organisation. Many reputations are riding on climate change and the Copenhagen conference, be they academic or political. Nobody really knows how our climate works. Many of the so-called predictions are based on computer simulations. Should we trust these unreservedly? The best theories we have to explain climate change are based on past data, which many experts admit are limited in variance. We should be very wary of not questioning the method. We are never sure what is causing it but there is little doubt that we must take action soon. I recommend to anyone who is interested in the topic, as we all should be, to look up Easter Island on the Internet for ten minutes to discover how what is being discussed in Copenhagen must come about.