Joe O'Toole (Independent)

To conclude, the advice from the Minister of State's Department is incorrect in that it states the chief executive and head of finance should attend all committee meetings. There is no other conclusion to be drawn from it. I do not argue about the difference between advising and reporting, which I accept. All I am saying is the advice should also be available for the chairman. I will not push the matter further. I am happy I have said what I have to say. There is a definite conflict between the Bill and the position of the Department - there is no question about this; it is there in black and white.

The other issues I raised concern the code of practice issued to every board and semi-State body. In recent months I was on two boards which went through this document to make sure they were compliant. Nobody said it had to be exactly the same in every State body but it was accepted that every State body had to do everything contained in it, although not all in the same way. In this case, we are not doing that.

This is what happens all the time in politics. It is what drives us into the ground. We have different rules for ourselves and everybody else. I guarantee that this is what the document appears to state. There are no winners in these situations. We should be a model of best practice and not follow others. We should be showing the way; we should be the guiding light on these issues, but we choose not to be. I have complete trust and confidence in the Secretary General and the head of finance, but that is not the issue. It is a matter of how we look at the issue and present the model. I will withdraw my amendments because I am not getting anywhere with them.