Paddy Burke (Fine Gael)

I do not want to hog this issue but if we were to believe what the Minister is telling us one would say there will be no change from the previous position. At the same time the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Gormley, has said on television and radio programmes that there will be major changes in planning laws and that he will control planning. The Minister of State appears to suggest there will not be much of a change but the reality is that there will be changes.

On the hub towns and gateways, the Minister has said clearly that the hubs and the gateways must grow to a certain population. We are aware from the Central Statistic Office figures that there is no growth in population but the Minister has said they must grow to the projected figures. If somebody brings forward a plan for a village or a small town which involves any small amount of zoning, the Minister will reject it because all those plans will have to go to the Minister's office. The Minister, Deputy Gormley, put his hand on the Mayo county development plan and said the plan did not take into consideration the hub status of Castlebar and Ballina and that it had to grow to a projected population before any of those other towns could grow or that a certain area within towns would not be released for development until Castlebar and Ballina have grown to a certain population. That is the crux of the issue, and that is the reality. We can have all the plans we want but the Minister, Deputy Gormley, will not allow them because they will involve extra zoning around small towns and villages which will curtail the hub towns and gateways growing to their projected populations.

The third point, which the Minister has not answered, concerns hub towns in different local authority areas such as Tuam in Galway and Castlebar in Mayo, and a town like Claremorris that is equidistant. Castlebar could have grown to its projected population but Tuam may not have done so, or vice versa. What will be the position with towns like Claremorris when it comes up for consideration for an area plan? The Minister will probably say that cannot be allowed because Tuam has not grown to its projected population or that Castlebar has not grown to its projected population. The Minister of State's office made clear to me that hub towns have been taken into account to allow for development in smaller towns. Will smaller towns have an effect on area plans if they are in a different local authority area?