David Norris (Independent)

I express my gratitude to Senator O'Toole and take up his question. I claim to be a Christian. I know it is a large claim, of which I am unworthy, but I can answer the Senator's question. Christ reproved the disciple who had cut off the centurion's ear and made him return his sword to the sheath when he was in danger of inevitable death.

On the triple lock mechanism, many think both Houses of the Oireachtas are involved, but that is not the case. This House is disbarred from involvement in such a decision. It is ridiculous and infantile; we should be involved because this is where one will hear the dissenting voices.

I believe in neutrality which is a very difficult concept. I was able to support the Lisbon treaty because I had received assurances from the Minister for Foreign Affairs that we would not engage with the European Defence Agency, formerly the European Armaments Group, given its previous track record of trying to develop a Europe-wide armaments export industry. I will hold him to that agreement and will table amendments to seek a veto for Ireland to veto any such arrangement. This is a central issue. I do not trust the European Defence Agency and the European armaments groups, particularly in the light of the debate on an Adjournment matter a number of weeks ago when I raised the question of the acquisition by the Minister for Defence of surveillance equipment worth some €2.37 million from Elbit Systems Limited, a Haifa-based Israeli company which has produced equipment which has been used in illegal surveillance operations along the illegal wall in Gaza. I draw the Minister's attention to the fact that the Norwegian finance Minister, Kristin Halvorsen, in referring to this company, stated Norway did not want to fund companies which so directly contributed to violations of international human rights law. Why is Ireland doing so? It is completely wrong. It worries me that the equipment concerned has been adapted for use in armoured vehicles built in South Africa because that brings us back to the apartheid regime when it collaborated with the Israeli military authorities in the development of weapons systems. We are still stuck in this system and I call on the Minister to revisit the issue. We know it is subject to an open tender process and supervised by the European Defence Agency, but that is another reason I am deeply suspicious. We need to look carefully and coldly at this issue and not get ourselves involved in disgraceful antics.

Why was Declan Ganley involved in the debate on the Lisbon treaty? It is perfectly obvious that he was against the Lisbon treaty because he was up to his ears in the American arms industry. Of course, he did not want us to enter into an exporting competition with the United States. That is what I am still gravely suspicious of. If my friend from Cavan can be parochial, I will be just as parochial by saying, like the Skibbereen Eagle, I will have my eye on the Minister and the European Defence Agency.