Alex White (Labour)

I welcome the Minister of State. Prior to the sos, the Minister for Finance was close to agreeing with me. Whereas he certainly would not be prepared to accept that this measure constituted a bailout for developers - a debate we can have another day - he was less concerned, annoyed or irritated with the suggestion made by Senator Ross that it clearly constituted a bailout for the banks. Senator Boyle referred to it as a rescue, a word the Minister preferred. I will not quibble as to which it is. However, we should be clear for ourselves and the public that what we are doing constitutes a bailout for and a rescue of the banks which are in such difficulty.

I want to touch on some issues that have already been raised and ask the Minister to comment on them. He introduced an amendment in the Dáil to what is now section 210 of the Bill which deals with guidelines on lending practices. I presume this was a response to legitimate concerns that, although the NAMA project is stated to be one that will bring about a change in the lending practices of the financial institutions and lead to a resumption of lending by the financial institutions, there is no guarantee this will occur. Very often the language used in ministerial speeches, as on this Bill, hedges on that question. For example, the word that appears most often in speeches - I think it appears in the Bill also - is "facilitate". It is suggested the measures will "facilitate" the financial institutions in returning to the job we all thought they were in place to do. I noted in an earlier speech in which the Minister was justifying the proposals made in the NAMA legislation that he said they would "thereby" bring about a resumption of lending practices. There is no guarantee this will occur and the Minister has, belatedly, responded by introducing the provision in the Bill, whereby he can introduce guidelines. However, we need more clarity on the issue and the public must be given far more by way of reassurance that a resumption will occur. There is a need to hear more than that the Bill "facilitates" a resumption of lending, "allows" the banks to resume lending or will bring about a scenario "whereby" the banks will be able to do so. That language does not deal with the question of whether it will happen. If greater certainty does not emerge from the Government on the matter, why should we accept its faith and hope this will occur, particularly given we are spending so much of this and future generation's taxes on this expensive and uncertain project?

I have never accepted that NAMA is the only game in town or represents the only legitimate approach to the problem. I accept that there is no basis for doing nothing and nobody has argued that we should wash our hands of the problem and hope everything will come right. Everybody accepts some action must be taken. However, I do not believe that throughout the long months of the summer and autumn the Minister investigated all avenues - certainly not to my satisfaction - in order that he could assure us this proposal was the only way to proceed. It does not seem to have the international or academic support often invoked by the Minister on its behalf. Some professional economists have come out in favour of it, but they seem to be largely individuals - good as they may be - who work for the existing financial institutions. While I do not suggest they have their comments written for them, we must take what they say in the context in which they find themselves.

We have seen the newspaper interventions by the 46 economists. The IMF is often invoked in support of NAMA, but what the IMF stated was that these asset management strategies were acceptable and legitimate, but that it was preferable they should happen alongside nationalisation. The OECD has also stated nationalisation should not be ruled out. Many of the bodies which have been invoked in support of this proposition are far less enthusiastic than has been suggested. One main belief among all of them is that it is good the Government is doing something. A measure of their relief is that, at least, it is seen to be doing something in the international context. That is what the European Union and international financial markets want to see.