Rónán Mullen (Independent)

Ba mhaith liom fáilte a chur roimh an Aire Stáit. Gabhaim leithscéal leis toisc nach bhfuil mé ach ag teacht agus ag imeacht, mar táim ag freastal ar chomchoiste ag a bhfuil Conradh na Gaeilge i láthair. I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Calleary.

The background of the Bill is the uncertainty regarding the status of registered employment agreements and employment regulation orders, both of which set wage levels and often other obligations such as those relating to sick pay, pensions and overtime in a particular industry. The wage levels thus agreed are referred to as the joint labour court or JLC rates. This mechanism, dating from the 1940s, was effectively an embryonic means of setting a minimum wage for particular categories of workers. It is interesting to note that the equivalent system in the United Kingdom was abolished in 1993 by the Conservative Government with the support of the trade unions which were of the view that such arrangements hindered collective bargaining. Given that these agreements set a level of pay in excess of the minimum wage, they are understandably resented by employers. It was for this reason that in 2008 their constitutionality and human rights aspect were challenged in the courts, with mixed success.

The Government promises to rectify the situation by way of this legislation which obliges the Minister to confirm the decisions of the various joint labour committees and the Labour Court and proposes that such decisions be put before the Houses of the Oireachtas which will have the power to annul them. IBEC has proposed an amendment to the effect that businesses be given a mechanism to opt out of JLC rates, similar to the opt-out clause afforded under the minimum wage legislation. According to a briefing from William Fry, the Minister of State, Deputy Calleary, in bringing forward this legislation, reiterated his previous comments that it may be timely to consider bringing the JLC and REA systems into line with the procedures already established under the National Minimum Wage Act 2000 which allows employers to submit inability to pay claims to the court in order to obtain a temporary exemption from the minimum wage obligation. In other words, there was an indication that something along the lines of the IBEC proposal would be introduced. The Minister of State may be able to enlighten me as to his intentions in this regard, but no such provision is included in the Bill presented to us today. Obviously, the unions will oppose any such provision and we must be mindful of the requirements of social partnership.

We are all aware that the extent of the economic difficulties we face is forcing us to question some of our most cherished assumptions. It is beyond dispute that all public policy in this area, as in many others, should start from the point that the dignity of the person must be the highest priority in all initiatives we propose and support. It is beyond dispute that when wages are too low, the dignity of the person is at risk and there is potential for abuse and exploitation. Historically, we are very aware of the suffering of people on low ages and such suffering remains in evidence in many parts of the world where people endure outrageous working conditions in return for a pittance that barely keeps body and soul together and is entirely insufficient to support families. On the other hand, recent experience in this State shows how wages that are too high can damage competitiveness, a consequence that will ultimately be to our social detriment.

While we all wish to see workers not only survive but thrive in terms of the wages they receive for the good work they do, we are also aware that high employment costs can have a negative impact, particularly in the very competitive and dangerous situation in which we currently find ourselves. That is why we should discuss and give careful consideration to the IBEC amendment. If we are minded to advocate such a change, whereby businesses would have a mechanism to opt out of JLC rate agreements in the same manner in which they can do so under the minimum wages legislation, I am confident there would be a beneficial effect for many of the businesses which provide employment throughout the State. For example, I am aware of a restaurant in a tourist location in County Clare which has opted not to offer Sunday lunch because of the astronomical staff costs involved. The closure of business premises and the associated loss of employment or services to communities is a far more detrimental outcome than any difficulties associated with a mechanism allowing employers to make the case that they should only pay a portion of JLC rates.

It is important that employers and employees know about their rights and obligations. Many employers are unaware of what they are required to do and consequently tend to get caught for arrears. On the other hand, many staff, especially young, foreign or non-unionised workers, are unaware of their rights. A potential solution might be to issue a booklet with the necessary information as each new PPS number is ascribed. The number of inspectors working for the National Employment Rights Authority is very small. This is something that should be reviewed once the recruitment freeze in the public sector is lifted.

Section 10 of the Bill which amends section 23 of the Industrial Relations Act allows officers of VECs, other than teachers, to access dispute settlement agencies, including the Labour Relations Commission and the Labour Court. This is welcome. Section 11 provides that in deciding whether to accept the recommendation of a joint labour committee, the Labour Court will have access to all submissions made by interested parties to the committee, not just the report of the chairman, as is currently the case. This too will be of assistance to both employers and employees. Mar achoimre ghairid, tá sé tábhachtach go mbeidh muid praiticiúil agus go dtuigeann muid go bhfuil sé práinneach go mbeadh cóimheá idir ceart an duine tuarastal ceart a fháil dá chuid oibre, de réir dínit an duine sin, agus ag an am céanna go dtuigeann muid gur ceart, má tá rátaí ró-ard á íoc, go mbeidh áiteanna á dhúnadh agus nach mbeadh sin ar mhaithe le leas an phobail, na heacnamaíochta ná na tíre. Mar sin, ba chóir dúinn ar a laghad plé a dhéanamh faoi leasú a thabharfadh deis do dhaoine gnó ráta níos lú a íoc i gcásanna áirithe, mar a tharlaíonn leis an minimum wage. Freisin, ba chóir dúinn a chinntiú go bhfuil dóthain eolais ar fáil ag daoine, idir fostóirí agus fostaithe maidir lena cearta agus dualgaisí. B'fhiú é nuair atá uimhir PPS á eisiú go mbeadh leabhrán ann a míneodh do ghach duine cad iad a cearta agus a dualgaisí atá rompu i gcásanna mar seo.