Dermot Ahern (Louth, Fianna Fail)

-----confirmed in the Dáil that, as far as he was concerned, there was jury intimidation in Limerick. Members of the Lower House said to me privately and publicly - the latter group includes Deputy Finian McGrath and the Minister of State, Deputy Peter Power - that when their constituents got a jury service summons they were shaking like leaves from fear. They tried to use every trick in the book to get out of giving jury service. Experience has shown that any time a jury trial is held in a place like Limerick there is a dramatic drop in the number of people coming forward. We have empirical evidence in that respect.

A number of speakers raised the issue of alternative methods. Many people accept that something has to be done to protect juries and recognise that unless steps are taken there will be an interference with the effective administration of justice. The focus is on the alternatives. As the Hederman report points out:

Comparisons with jury practice in the United States, and it could equally be said for other countries, is essentially misplaced. In larger countries, trials with anonymous juries often take place in sensitive cases. Unlike a vast country with a huge population such as the United States, the small and dispersed nature of Irish society means that the risk of jury tampering and intimidation will remain significant.

Suggestions of cases with juries behind protective screens inevitably convey to the jury the belief that these precautions are necessary in respect of a particular accused. This effectively removes, in the jury's eyes, the presumption of innocence because it indicates in unmistakable terms to the jury that the accused is an extremely dangerous person and will stop at nothing to obtain acquittal.

I strongly urge Senators, as I urged Deputies in the Lower House, to accept that what we are about here is sending a strong signal to the wider community, particularly the criminals who orchestrate these gangs, that if they continue with this they will get the full rigours of this law. In addition, inasmuch as we can do so within any democracy, we will prevent them from intimidating witnesses and jurors. I am not saying this in an emotive way, but it is important that on 8 February 2008, Stephen Collins wrote to my predecessor as Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform and I will quote from the letter as follows:

We were assured that we would always have the support of the State to protect us and we were told the State owed us a debt of gratitude for all our help. [He finished by saying] We are a hard-working, honest family who were put in this position by one of Ireland's most dangerous thugs. We know the service we have done for the State has saved many lives and improved the quality of life for many more. We are praying that the State could now improve the quality of our lives which at present is a living hell.

He wrote that letter months before his son was murdered. Following his son's murder, Mr. Collins subsequently wrote to me on 18 May 2009. He was aware of what we were proposing because I had already stated publicly exactly what we were proposing in this Bill. He finished a very emotive letter by stating:

Please get the proposed new laws passed as a matter of urgency. Myself, my family and the whole community are depending on it.

On why we are rushing this legislation, I can put it no better than Mr. Collins who said that neither he nor his family could wait three months. He validly said that the only people who should fear this legislation are the criminals and that the ordinary decent people of this country have nothing to fear.