Martin Brady (Fianna Fail)

I welcome the Minister, Deputy Mary Hanafin, and her officials to the House. I welcome many aspects of this Bill. There are a couple of sections with which I have concerns, but I particularly welcome the increase for social welfare recipients and the fuel scheme for the elderly.

As Senator McFadden stated, the fuel scheme is a big issue with the elderly, quite a number of whom in my constituency are concerned. They cannot understand why the price of gas and electricity is increasing all the time when the price of oil is coming down. It is difficult for them to understand that. Sometimes I do not understand it myself. Perhaps that is a matter we should examine.

Under section 14, the supplementary welfare allowance scheme provides for rent supplement where the HSE is involved. The HSE is involved with some 1,600 persons in this position. It has come to my attention in recent times that there is widespread abuse of this system, for example, where persons pretending to be landlords let their houses to their partners, and both are living in the same house. They are getting money from the Government or the HSE, which ever way one likes to put it, under false pretences. That cannot be allowed continue.

There are others who will tell us that they have two or three children unemployed who are living at home, and the parents get no allowance for them. I suppose we cannot give an allowance for everything, but they make the point that if their children rent a house, the HSE will pay for it. It is a fair point. They also make the point of course, as Senator McFadden has stated, and which we hear all the time, that there are families and households which have a larger income on social welfare than a family who are working. That is a fact. I am aware of many such cases. I do not know what the Minister can do about that.

In reference to Part 4, sections 26 to 29, inclusive, the Citizens Information Board and Money Advice and Budgeting Service provide a tremendous service. It is efficient and professional. Perhaps I am wrong and I am missing some points, but I believed that when these agencies were amalgamated there would be a cost saving and that was the idea of amalgamating or rearranging them. I note that nothing really has changed. They have the same number of buildings and staff, although I do not know their grades. In Coolock, to give a typical example, we have those services all under the one roof. In other places there are three or four services such as the citizens information service, the MABS and family mediation services within a mile of each other. In making the point about this when I spoke here previously, by amalgamation, I meant that there would be a saving, there would be reorganisation and that the services would be more effective. The Minister stated that this provides for the extension of the functions of the Citizens Information Board to include responsibility for the provision of the Money Advice and Budgeting Service. As far as I am concerned, the Money Advice and Budgeting Service did not need advice. It was providing a perfectly good service, in my estimation.

The purpose of the measure is to provide that the board will support the provision of the MABS, will compile and publish data, undertake research, report back to the Minister, etc. I would have thought that such would have been taking place all time, that it would be part of the management's responsibility. I now realise it is something new, which surprises me.

The Minister further stated that the Bill amends the Citizens Information Acts on the provision of financial assistance to voluntary bodies to include the MABS companies. I am a little lost as to who is doing what or why the Minister needs to have anybody at this stage doing research and publishing data, for which the board would be responsible. I would have thought that both of those agencies would have had to conform with that type or responsibility and regulation in the first place.

The Minister moved on then to the Combat Poverty Agency, which no doubt was doing a good job as well, as Senator McFadden stated. I have never had any problems with it, although others may have had.

The Government announced in the budget the integration of the Combat Poverty Agency and the office for social inclusion within the Department of Social and Family Affairs in line with the recommendations of a review of the Combat Poverty Agency that was undertaken on foot of a Government decision on 6 June 2007. The Bill provides for the dissolution of the agency and the transfer of its permanent employees, who are to become civil servants. Will the people currently employed in the Combat Poverty Agency become civil servants when they are transferred? Pension and superannuation liabilities will be transferred to the Minister for Finance. I do not wish to criticise the decision but perhaps I do not grasp the point.