Joe O'Toole (Independent)

In fairness, we cannot but say that Deputy Ryan is a listening Minister, in terms of the number of changes and amendments that he has been prepared to take on board as we have gone through this Bill. I always believe this reflects a confident Minister in charge of his or her brief. I welcome the fact that he has listened to our arguments on this general area of the issue under discussion, independent radio production.

Starting from where he began he has come to the point he is at now, and that is to be welcomed as measurable quantifiable progress. I shall support his amendment because I like to tie down progress when I see it. However, will the Minister not think further on this as it goes through the other House? Perhaps he will come to the Seanad again, afterwards. I want to give a couple of reasons for this. Just to get critical mass into radio production, more money needs to be diverted in its direction. I speak of somebody who is completely supportive of public service broadcasting, as the Minister is well aware. I am very much supportive of RTE and of its line with regard to the division of moneys.

It would be very good for us to have thriving independent creative and self-sufficient independent production. Speaking as a trade unionist, I am appalled at the conditions of service — pay, salaries and everything else — that are available to people working in independent radio and broadcasting. I ask the Minister to talk to a few people in this regard. The next time he is being interviewed by somebody on local radio or on independent television he should ask what he or she is earning. The next time he dealing with anybody in those areas, he should ask about his or her career structure, if only to inform himself.

I raise this for the following reason. If there was a thriving independent production sector, where there was movement in and out of local and independent radio and RTE, with some equality in terms of the conditions of service that could be offered in all cases, we should all be the beneficiaries. People can argue that this is not about conditions of service. To me, it is one of the issues that arise from it. If we want to match like with like, some element of security must be given to those involved. I know the private sector does not like the idea of employment security, instead preferring to give employees short-term contracts and then kicking them out the door when finished. If that is the society people choose, then it is fine. A balance, however, is needed.

The Minister's proposal gives the start to what I want to achieve — a thriving independent radio production sector, which is very important. Less money is being put into independent radio production. If the Minister examines this he will agree with me. While I accept and welcome the proposal which will give some life to and recognition of independent radio production, it is not enough. I cannot add to the argument put forward on Committee Stage. I know no further progress will be made on the issue and the Minister does not need to kill my arguments with his briefing. However, when the buckets and spades are out in the summer and the Minister will be around the country listening to local radio, will he consider the issues I have raised?

He should examine also some of the overheads and margins for independent radio production companies and compare these with the quality of their productions and the outlets they provide. Many young graduates in broadcasting production from colleges of technology can make an input in this sector. I want a career structure to be identifiable in the independent radio sector. Many graduates get several years' experience in the sector but cannot afford to stay in it. I know it is not the Minister's fault. However, ensuring a thriving sector would be beneficial to everyone.

As a supporter of public service broadcasting, it is not healthy that RTE is the only customer in this market. Ways must be examined to ensure similar demand comes from independent radio. This debate went through Second and Committee Stages. The Minister listened and said he would return on Report Stage with proposals. I welcome the Minister's amendments which meet some of the issues already raised. However, it does not go far enough. Will he examine how to extend this proposal to the peripheral areas I mentioned?