Dan Boyle (Green Party)

Spike Island has been taken off the agenda. There had been talk of a new prison in the Kilworth area which, as a parallel, has many of the disadvantages highlighted in the debate on Thornton Hall vis-À-vis Mountjoy in that it is 30 miles outside Cork city, does not have a dedicated public transport network and is compromised in terms of offering family support by way of visitation, which should be an essential part of a rehabilitation process in any prison sentence. The Minister of State might indicate whether progress is possible in that area.

The question of the nature of prisons is not proper for this debate. It is a technical motion and as Senator Regan said, there will be a debate on the Bill itself but we need a debate in this House. The issue of whether some prisoners should be serving sentences and the accommodation problem, which is causing difficulties at both ends in that prisoners who should get longer custodial sentences are not getting them because there is not enough space in our prisons, has been raised on the Order of Business on many occasions. When we have that debate it will be informed by an appropriate contribution from the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform.

Even though my party is supportive of the construction of Thornton Hall, given the progress that has been made on the development of the site, I am concerned about some aspects of the way the development is to proceed. This technical motion refers only to the prison development. We do not know the position regarding the reception centre for people seeking asylum and immigration status, which is open to debate and causes concern in wider society.

The question of the Central Mental Hospital is also left open. As a third area I am glad that is the case because the economics that inform the idea of selling the entire Dundrum site for the Central Mental Hospital and moving it to Thornton Hall no longer necessarily applies. We should use the change in the economic circumstances and the uncertainty of the property market to question whether the move — which has questionable moral justification — from Dundrum to Thornton Hall can now best be considered by redevelopment of the Dundrum site.

The Patients not Prisoners report published on Tuesday by the Irish Mental Health Coalition shows the way regarding a partial sale of the Dundrum site that would allow the full redevelopment of the Central Mental Hospital in Dundrum. Given that the Taoiseach in particular has said he is prepared to examine areas of public expenditure and certain policy areas, this is a good opportunity to do so in regard to an unnecessary linkage that exists between a health issue and a justice and prisons issue. I hope he will take that opportunity.

I share the concern articulated by Senator Regan about the preferred bidder in this site. I have no questions about the tendering process, which has been done with as much efficacy as possible, but the fact that it has delivered a company that is currently under a critical eye raises questions about that very tendering process and the contracting that follows therefrom. It should be an element of any contract with companies providing services to the State, particularly regarding capital infrastructure, that there is consistency in their dealings with the State. If a company provides a large piece of infrastructure in the form of a prison and chooses not to provide other forms of infrastructure in the form of social housing, that raises serious questions about the nature of that contracting system. I ask that the tendering process and contracts be examined in that regard.

Regarding public private partnerships, I helped author a report on the need to tighten up many contracts in this area. I am not talking about PPPs specifically but the principles are the same in that the State enters into a contractual relationship and too often the nature of those contracts are stand alone and they do not take into account the history of the company concerned in terms of working with the State and the ability to see through any contract agreed.

I have expressed my reservations about the wider aspects of the Thornton Hall development while acknowledging my party's support for the motion before the House and envisaging the development of the prison.

In response to points raised by Senator O'Toole, we need to improve the planning process but also recognise that when we propose projects of this nature, where at the very least there is a social inconvenience, we should promote the idea of community contracting. It is not just a matter of the nuts and bolts of the planning process, walls of various heights and buildings at certain distances from each other. There should be a parallel process of contracting services in the community and ensuring the community gets access to them — the point Senator O'Toole made — as a result of living with what is a social inconvenience. I hope the wider legislation that will come before us will deal with those points because it would help towards the long-term acceptance of a project where the local community is uncomfortable with what has been done to date and what is proposed.