Mary Harney (Dublin Mid West, Progressive Democrats)

I will not deal with a particular company because this legislation is not about a particular set of circumstances. We are not prohibiting co-location. For as long as I can remember, doctors and pharmacists have been in close proximity to each other. What we are seeking to ensure is that a doctor cannot have an interest in the pharmacy business and vice versa. We are also ensuring any rent paid must be at the normal rate. This may differ in areas, as it would perhaps be more expensive in the centre of Dublin than in Carlow or elsewhere. We are giving both regulatory bodies very strong powers in these matters. It will be professional misconduct to enter into an agreement where above normal market rent is being charged for a premises. For example, if it were the case that a doctor's rent was subsidised and a pharmacist's rent was hiked, I would have a significant number of concerns. The primary concern would be for the taxpayer, because as the purchaser of 80% of drugs, we would be paying for this. Nobody will do it on the basis of charity.

I have no philosophical or other objection to people making profits. As I stated the other evening, if people could not make profits, they would not be in business and if we did not have profit, we would not have much innovation in the provision of drugs, therapies and health care treatment. Most are funded by private providers rather than governments worldwide. We are looking to ensure patient safety will not be put at risk and that vulnerable cases will not be exploited using economic measures to blatantly discriminate against or favour one set of circumstances over another. That is not acceptable.

When I brought the Bill to the Cabinet, we sought to deal with the matter in a different fashion but we were strongly advised that we could not do so for constitutional and other legal reasons. The Attorney General advised us that this was the appropriate route and, on reflection, it is a good one because we are now giving powers not just to the Pharmaceutical Society of Ireland but the Irish Medical Council also. I have written to the council about some of these matters, as under its existing powers, it is not in a position to deal with these issues. We are amending the Medical Practitioners Act 1978 through a new Bill before the other House which will be presented in this House shortly. We are including both bodies in these amendments, which is good.

I am a strong fan of competition which drives innovation and delivers better value for money for consumers. It has been argued that as the State pays every pharmacist in the country the same price for the same products, this may not be very competitive. Competition is not perfect by any means. My good friend Senator Minihan keeps me well informed about developments in the pharmacy business and tells me how difficult things are.