Shane Ross (Independent)

I will give Senator Mansergh something constructive to say if I keep going. We are talking about a tiny amount of money to be saved by a large number of people who badly need houses. Quite honestly, I do not care if this comes about through the abolition of stamp duty, mortgage relief or by injecting that money straight into people's pockets. This is a justifiable cause and a justifiable expense. Other than for first-time buyers, stamp duty should be a different kettle of fish.

Senator Mansergh acknowledged one awful inequity — the graded form of stamp duty whereby one pays the full amount rather than paying the steps up. One goes from 3% to 6% to 9% and then one pays 9% on the whole lot at a reasonably low level. That is pretty inequitable. However, I do not think it is inequitable for old people to be exempt from paying stamp duty on the new houses they buy if they trade down. The reason for this is twofold. It is quite ingenious on the part of the Fine Gael Party to come up with this idea. First, it would save old people a certain amount of money but, second, it would get some mobility going in certain areas where old single people occupy large houses and young people with families occupy small houses. It is as simple as that.

We live in a dysfunctional environment. It would be simple to have a system whereby a person could sell his or her house without paying any capital gains tax if he or she lived in it, move into a smaller house and pay no tax on the move. People would begin to move, which would allow younger people with families move into larger houses. In north Dublin and probably in other areas of which I am unaware, there are many old people hanging on in large houses feeling paralysed about moving at their old age because they do not want to spend that 9% or perhaps less on stamp duty and removals.

That is an imaginative proposal the Government could happily take up and it could also take up the same proposal for disabled people. It would not cost much and would obviously have a beneficial social effect. It is not beyond the imagination of anybody in the Government to devise a means whereby a removal of the stamp duty would not go straight into the hands of the developer. That should be done quickly, in fact, it should be done in next week's budget. I note Senator Mansergh did not have the mandate to come out and say it would not be done.