Tony Killeen (Clare, Fianna Fail)

There is some confusion arising from the fact that we are dealing with a definition of consultation. To deal with the question raised by Senator McDowell first, the definition of consultation means an exchange of views and establishment of dialogue between the three. It means much more than circulating a newsletter or sending an e-mail. It is a quite different process from the fear expressed by Senator McDowell.

To respond to the point made by Senator O'Toole, in this definition section I seek to provide for a choice. Subsequently there are situations where the trigger mechanism, which Senator O'Toole will oppose strongly and which brings a different kind of process into effect in some instances, comes into play and where Senator Quinn will state strongly to me that the trigger mechanism is set at far too low a threshold. There will be strong disagreement when we come to that stage but that is irrelevant in this context of the definition of "consultation". It would be entirely wrong to preclude employees, who currently have an arrangement in place or who might want in the future to have an enhanced arrangement in place to deal directly with their employers, from doing so. My understanding is that if it is not included in the definition, it is effectively excluded.

There are subsequent provisions in the legislation which will deal specifically with cases where representatives come into play. Obviously since we have left the choice "the employees' representative or representatives" here, we provide for that as well. In fact, the fears of the Senators on the inclusion of "one or more employees" are misplaced in this instance because we are dealing with the definition. I will disagree with the same point when they make it in the case of the trigger mechanism at a later stage in any event.