Brian Lenihan Jnr (Dublin West, Fianna Fail)

I thank Senators for their kind remarks regarding the Minister and his officials and also their industry in considering the legislation. I also single out Senator Henry for her extraordinary interest in the measure.

The Trial of Lunatics Act was enacted in 1883. While some time has elapsed since the Minister of State has given effect to the bulk of recommendations in Mr. Justice Henchy's committee, the judge is still with us and I wish him continued long life. A considerable time has elapsed since the Minister implemented those recommendations, but he has done so. Such legislation is being enacted for the first time in 122 years and must now go before the other House.

Perhaps it is the subject matter which makes it difficult to legislate too often in this area. The Trial of Lunatics Act 1883 caused its own difficulties. Queen Victoria was very unwilling to sign it because she objected to the idea that her potential assassin could receive a verdict of not guilty for reason of insanity. Therefore, a legal verdict of guilty but insane was applied. This was an absurdity, because the purpose of deeming a person insane is to excuse him or her of the offence and not suggest he or she is guilty but insane.

This is a difficult branch of the law and one of those areas where psychiatry and law meet but do not necessarily arrive at the same conclusions. As legislators, we must instil in the population a respect for the courts and personal responsibility. Psychiatry, with all its insights, could lead to an equation whereby there is no personal responsibility. It is a difficult line to draw, but the Minister has conscientiously tried to do so. He was happy to accept many of the constructive suggestions put forward by Senators in the course of the debate.

I understand the Cathaoirleach does not like contentious replies on Final Stage and I am very grateful to Senators for how they considered the measure. The Minister wants maximum care and treatment for those committed to his charge in the penal system as well as those who come before the courts and are found not guilty by reason of insanity. It has been accepted that once that verdict is brought in the person then becomes subject to the definition with regard to treatment as outlined in the legislation. It is important that the foundation is in place, though it is philosophically difficult to decide on the ideal foundation. However, the many practical changes, in particular those advocated by Senator Henry with regard to the transfer of persons between different institutions, would be extremely important in laying a legislative foundation for a more humane system of treatment for such persons.