Fergal Browne (Fine Gael)

We are fully in favour of that approach. I was in contact with the Health Service Executive yesterday and was informed that the practice of the former health board in the Carlow area was that 75% of a pension was taken, which makes perfect sense. Nobody would query that. The Government and politicians have failed miserably.

We should not forget that the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Deputy McDowell, was Attorney General at the time. I want to put that back on the record as it has conveniently been forgotten. The Tánaiste was also in the Cabinet with a different portfolio. Collective responsibility does apply.

A meeting took place when difficulties were pointed out. That meeting appears to have been completely farcical; Ministers arrived late, left early or missed a crucial part of the meeting. The minutes of the meeting appear not to have been given to the relevant Ministers, nor were the difficulties pointed out to them. This comes across as being extremely amateurish.

The effect is that taxpayers are faced with a significant bill of up to €500 million, if not more. Today's Irish Independent refers to a sum of €1 billion on the basis that people would get back interest on top of the money they are owed. Will the Tánaiste please clarify this point in her concluding remarks?

Another issue of concern is the entitlements of those people who tried to get their aged parents or relatives into public beds in nursing homes but were unable to do so because no public beds were available. Such people had no choice but to avail of private nursing homes. I believe 20 legal writs have already been issued in connection with such cases. If those court cases succeed, they will open an enormous can of worms. The Ombudsman, Emily O'Reilly, has already publicly stated her belief that they have a very good case. The premise is that if one is aged over 70 years and is entitled to free medical care in a public nursing home, one should be entitled to a similar level of free care in a private nursing home as the State has not fulfilled its obligations.

I understand that 275,000 potential cases exist. Some 27,000 cases are pending in the former South Eastern Health Board area, of which 5,500 relate to County Carlow. The Tánaiste can correct me if I am wrong but the average length of stay for patients in nursing homes is ten months. According to figures I received from the Health Service Executive people would be entitled to approximately €6,000. If people spent more or less time in a nursing home then the figure would vary. The Government tried to give an ex gratia payment of €2,000, which is significantly below the figure to which they may be properly entitled. At the time we pointed out that it would only take one successful court case to challenge that and the floodgates would be opened. The Supreme Court judgment has now saved us getting to that stage.

I am interested in ascertaining the terms of reference of the report being carried out by Mr. John Travers. Will the Tánaiste clarify if the infamous meeting with Ministers coming and going will be included in the terms of reference? That was a key meeting when the issue of illegal charging for nursing home care was raised, yet it was not brought to the Ministers' attention, or so they claim. That issue must be examined as a matter of urgency.

It is vital that people who are owed money do not have to go to the courts. The last thing we need is a repeat of the Army deafness claim, which ultimately proved a disgrace in terms of the amount of money paid out to the legal teams involved.