Ulick Burke (Fine Gael)

I welcome the Minister to the House. I acknowledge that many aspects of the budget were welcome in that they were corrective of what was done a year ago. While Senator Wilson wildly embraces many aspects of the budget, the reality is that many of the measures in it merely compensate for the cutbacks made last year and the many stealth taxes imposed in the intervening period. The increased cost of electricity, services, gas, food and all of the other aspects of rip-off Ireland that we have heard about are the ones to which the elderly and the poor are most vulnerable. Nevertheless there are aspects of the budget that represent a welcome U-turn on decisions taken in the previous budget.

It would be unfair not to acknowledge the work of the excellent personnel in the Department of Social and Family Affairs. They are more courteous and helpful than officials in many other Departments. I have noticed a very welcome change in their attitude toward people who seek help and information for them. It is very important that the people at the coalface dealing with the public should be of that frame of mind.

Other Senators referred to the issue of fraud. People who commit social welfare fraud are taking from those in greatest need. That said, there is an urgent need for training for some of inspectors working in the area because it seems their goal is to humiliate the people who approach them rather than anything else. There is a need to review the process of dealing with claimants as a matter of urgency. In one instance in County Galway they are brought into a hotel in a public manner and lined up to wait for the call which is made publicly in a humiliating manner. It is time to review that process, given that the Department has offices in practically every town in the country. If there is a necessity to upgrade those to make them suitable for interviewing of this nature that is what should be done rather than the humiliation that follows from the other process.

Recently the Society of St. Vincent de Paul indicated that it has had more calls for help this year than in any previous year. Surely that indicates that there are more people in trouble and in need of support. An organisation such as the Society of St. Vincent de Paul has limited resources and funding. I have had two telephone calls in the past week from people in absolute desperation. They are people to whom the Society of St. Vincent de Paul cannot provide sufficient assistance to get them through the difficult Christmas period. Many unfortunate people are being forced back into the arms of moneylenders and will find themselves in a vicious circle from which it will be difficult to escape down the line, regardless of how well social welfare schemes are resourced by the Minister's Department.

It is important that these, usually illegal, moneylenders are identified and put out of business quickly. They are the ruination of many poor people, which leads to many other difficulties in society as it may force people to turn to crime in order to access money, goods or services. The work of many other charitable organisations that support the less well-off on a once-off basis at Christmas, such as the Lions Clubs and Rotary Clubs, must be acknowledged.

I welcome that the Minister has given €700,000 in additional funding to citizens' advice bureaux. However, it is easy to advise people on how best to spend when their resources are meagre. Nevertheless, the bureaux offer a helpful service to many people.

Over the last few days, and today in particular, there has been much comment on the failure of the Government to acknowledge the money that was taken illegally from many pensioners down the years. I mentioned this issue on the Order of Business and was told by the Cathaoirleach that this would be the appropriate time to discuss it. One must weigh the sum of €2,000 that is proposed to refund to each person against the efforts and endeavours of these elderly people and their families to put together savings that were taken illegally from them over a number of years in order to maintain them in long-stay residential care institutions.

No Government or Minister can stand back and refuse to pay back this money. People may say that a refund of €2,000 to some 20,000 pensioners represents a significant sum of money. However, pensioners have been paying approximately €8,500 per annum over a period of time in long-stay institutions. Money was taken from them by the health boards and other authorities through their pension books. Therefore, the Minister for Social and Family Affairs and his colleagues in Government have a responsibility to ensure this money is paid back.

It is not unusual, particularly in rural Ireland, for some families to have to sell the family home in order to provide for the long-term care of an elderly relative. It is important to recognise that the health boards, through some of their officers, were enthusiastic to claim and demand that these maintenance payments were made. Assessments were made against people which meant that the value of their property had to be handed over to the health boards in order to provide the care required.

This is a serious situation. I hope 2004 will not end without the Government taking greater action than has been taken to date. The €2,000 refund is a token response and I hope the Government will go down the line and do the decent thing. If it is the case that Departments have officially robbed these elderly people, how can we point the finger at the tax collector who is going after those who have not paid their taxes? The Government is taking a major risk, as evidenced by the plea on this evening's news that people not go down the road of litigation. I hope the Government can prevent such a possibility by acting quickly in a positive way to repay the losses to so many people, particularly the elderly.