Joe O'Toole (Independent)

With all due respect to the Minister of State, his replies are unclear. I thought the matter was clear at the beginning but it is becoming more confused. That is the case with regard to the issue of what facilitation means and the points that were raised about the shortage of therapists. I have said before that there is a shortage of doctors. From examining what has happened, we know that the majority of people placed in medical schools in Ireland are women. We also know that the average period those women graduates spend in practice is five to seven years, although I do not have the figures in front of me. In many cases they do not continue. I am only making that as a statement of statistical fact. I am not presenting this in any kind of sexist fashion. We know the numbers who return to medical practice as specialists later. Could the health service executive demand an increased intake into the medical colleges to ensure that in ten years time additional doctors will be available?

Fianna Fáil speakers referred to the lack of therapists but there is currently a shortage of every kind of therapist in this country. In addition, there are all sorts of practices concerning what qualifications are recognised. Twenty years ago, a European directive required the mutual recognition of third level professional qualifications in the EU member states, yet we have got nowhere with it. People who may be fully qualified in certain countries are not recognised as such here. Will the health service executive be able to insist that a new school of pharmacy should be established? I take that as an example because we are aware of the mess we got into previously with the Department of Education and Science arguing with two different third level institutions about where such a school might be situated.

Can the health service executive take initiatives? When the Minister of State answered the question the first time, it seemed he was saying that the executive's involvement would only be to pay whatever aspect of the cost relates to the in-service, in-house, in situ, institutional training of these professionals. As the debate has continued, however, the Minister of State seems to be saying that the executive will have some control or influence over the delivering institutions. What is the situation? Will the executive have an input into the numbers of people who will qualify?