Fergal Browne (Fine Gael)

My question is whether the Hanly report is dead or alive or is it politically still in the accident and emergency unit? Every week Senator Leyden goes on and on saying it is gone. The former Minister, Deputy Michael Smith, has publicly broken ranks by stating he is against it. We had the ludicrous scenario of the former Minister for Health and Children going around parts of the country such as Nenagh and Ennis a few weeks before the local elections telling people not to mind the Hanly report because nothing is going to happen.

What is the status of the Hanly report? The Fianna Fáil amendment does not mention it, nor does it indicate that Fianna Fáil is in favour of it. The absence of Fianna Fáil Members from the Chamber does not augur well for it. They are obviously terrified to speak on this issue because they know the Hanly report is a disaster.

Most people would have no difficulty in travelling a distance for elective surgery. Most people in Carlow would have no difficulty travelling to Dublin, Waterford or Kilkenny for elective surgery. However, they have grave difficulty with the withdrawal of their accident and emergency and acute services. Anyone who has had to use those services recently will not want to see them abolished. That is a fundamental flaw in the Hanly report.

Coupled with that is the fact that we do not have people employed in the ambulance service who can administer the level of medical care that is needed. Other countries have a very highly-skilled, professionally-trained ambulance staff. We do not have that here. Our staff are trained only to carry out a very limited number of medical procedures. That is a fundamental flaw. The Minister cannot say that if the accident and emergency service is withdrawn from Kilkenny, it can provide a better ambulance service. I know of one recent example of a person in Carlow who started to choke when a piece of rasher got stuck in her throat and she had to drive all the way to Kilkenny. One can imagine how terrified she was. Imagine how she would have felt if she had had to go to Waterford, which is twice the distance. Let it be clear that people have no difficulty travelling for elective surgery, but they have great difficulty with the withdrawal of accident and emergency and acute services. That is the fundamental flaw in the Hanly report.

The impression has been given that Mary Harney was born only six weeks ago and had no part to play in Government. She has been in Government since 1997. In Cabinet there is meant to be collective responsibility, although we did not see it today when Senator Morrissey and the Minister for Transport, Deputy Cullen, were tearing each other asunder on radio. She was there and she approved the budgets. She cannot, therefore, blame the previous Ministers for Health and Children, Deputies Cowen and Martin. She bears responsibility. It is nauseating to see her carrying on lately as if she has had nothing to do with health over the past seven years. She had and the public are not so foolish as to believe otherwise.

Last Monday week, having been appointed spokesperson on health, I went with Deputy Twomey to St. Luke's Hospital in Kilkenny where there was no one on trolleys in the corridors. That has nothing to do with Deputies Harney or Tim O'Malley.