David Norris (Independent)

I congratulate the Leader on taking a firm stand. She has enhanced the dignity of the House by so doing and has the support of all Members from the various groups. I will not dwell on any of the contentious material that surrounded the subsequent part of that little discussion. I hope the focus will not be blurred because the banter that took place subsequently could have that effect. Something very important happened here today; the Leader had the courage to stand up for the dignity and independence of the House and that will be welcomed and supported by all Members.

The House will be sitting next week. I asked yesterday if time could be arranged for a debate on the Middle East, in particular on Iraq. The Leader reasonably said that since the House was only sitting today and tomorrow, there would probably not be time for that debate. As the House is now meeting next week, I ask the Leader if it would be possible to have that debate or even a short period for statements in the light of the worsening situation. The Government, of whatever legitimacy, of Iraq, yesterday came under mortar fire in its enclosed compound. That does not suggest it is very stable.

I regard Ms Lara Marlowe as a very balanced reporter. In yesterday's The Irish Times she described how the American soldiers spat at her because she was dressed in Iraqi traditional clothing:

Soldiers spitting at Iraqi cars and prisoners being tortured are symptomatic of the same danger, an arrogant, selfish, deaf, blind, but vociferous, US Administration that acts with impunity over the world.

It is important that this is recognised. As people who have the privilege to live in a comparatively safe and comfortable environment, we must put on the record our feelings for people in the rest of the world who are much more vulnerable than we are.

I join with Senator Ryan in saying the Leader was very tantalising, almost as tantalising as Senator Ryan himself about his reasons for staying in Cork, when she said that very interesting comments were made to her. I hope she will be able to share those with the House.

I support Senator O'Toole's comments about senior civil servants. We have secured our pay increase to which we are perfectly entitled and which I intend to accept. It is wrong, however, that senior civil servants should be cut out, especially when there have been warnings that we might face a brain drain if the Civil Service, which as Senator O'Toole said is excellent and did us proud during the EU Presidency, is faced with the situation that people with similar talents get twice or four times the amount of money in the private sector. That would be a pity.