Joe McHugh (Fine Gael)

I felt it did not have the teeth because it did not have the resources. However, things change. The Government, including the Progressive Democrats, did not do its homework when it forgot that dormant accounts could be a significant resource — some would call it a significant slush fund. However, it became obvious this was likely to be a significant resource. Deputy Ó Cuív's ministerial colleagues realised they were dealing with a budget of €60 million for 2004, which might increase to at least €225 million and perhaps €250 million in three years, as the Minister of State noted. Figures available to me suggest it could go to €500 million in three years. Ministers who were under pressure at Cabinet due to promises made at the last general election decided they wanted to get their paws on the money. This is why I wanted the Minister, Deputy Ó Cuív, present in the House for this debate. He is a competent and confident Minister and I am surprised his Cabinet colleagues are taking a hand at him. However, I am sure he will get the message in the short term.

The other reason I wanted to speak in this debate was to emphasise the importance of this issue and the outrageousness of the legislation. The Bill undermines the confidence of the community and voluntary sector and the relationship built up in regard to ADM Limited since 1992. The Bill should not be before the House. A body was set up and was working in this area. Why redesign the wheel when it is not broken? If it is a question of resources, why not employ the extra staff dotted throughout the country who could do with extra work? The Minister of State has already stated that, at some stage, additional staff may be required under the new mechanism. Why not do this under the current mechanism? The removal of representation from ADM Limited is the first part of the process to undermine the healthy work which has been ongoing. That representation linked the community and voluntary sector with the political sector.

The significance of the current situation lies in the timing of this legislation, which is being dealt with in late June and early July. The Minister of State knows that those involved in the community and voluntary sector carry out the majority of their administration work in the winter. However, most of the sector's programmes take place over the summer, whether out of school hours programmes for children in June, July and August, community youth work, or working and engaging with the community. The implementation programme is carried out during the summer. To introduce the Bill at this time is to set a dangerous precedent and there will be a backlash from the community and voluntary sector, which is unprepared for the legislation.

I am totally opposed to the Bill. There has been a lack of communication and consultation and the community and voluntary sector is not aware of what is going on. It is politicising a fund which could have been earmarked for the community and voluntary sector. It could have been decided by the independent and transparent forum which was already set up. However, that forum is being replaced by a similar board, although the ultimate responsibility for decision making will not lie with ADM but with Department officials and Ministers.

The primary legislation was good and had the confidence of the community and voluntary sector. There is absolutely no reason to move the goalposts. ADM was a transparent and representative body, and publicly accountable to the Committee of Public Accounts. In regard to funding and accounting procedures, the existing dormant accounts board employed a consultancy company to make sure everything was above board. It was serious about its business. While there may have been a question regarding resources and a lack of qualified staff to appraise different applications, all that was required was the employment of extra staff, which should not have been difficult.

That was the situation in regard to the primary legislation. However, a highly politicised appraisal body has now been set up, which no longer deals simply with dormant accounts but which is broken into four or five different mechanisms. I accept there will be an open, advertised application process which can be accessed online. That is not a problem. The next stage is the assessment, when civil servants begin working in liaison with their bosses, the Ministers. The second appraisal stage begins when the results are reported to the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy Ó Cuív, and his Department. There is a third appraisal stage when the results return for Government approval at Cabinet level. The Minister constantly talks about the need to get rid of bureaucracy and the legislative barriers to getting work done.