David Norris (Independent)

Yes. However, I have no intention of speaking about it. As this matter is sub judice, it would be dishonourable of me to say the same things and I do not intend to do so. That person is entitled to protection from the immunity that I receive. I am being circumspect but when this is over I might be able to look at some of the other issues involved in the two cases.

I am concerned, however, that there is an inadequate relationship between the Judiciary and the Oireachtas. Judges criticise us and sometimes it is difficult if we criticise them in return. However, there should be a channel of communication. I am aware of situations where, for example, in an application for a licence, the public, police and the local authority objected but the licence was still granted. I am not criticising the judge. It may well be that there is a lacuna in the law and the judge is compelled to grant licences because of the way we drafted the law. We should examine this.

I am more worried than ever about this situation. I mentioned something yesterday on the Order of Business and I am repeating it today because of the Minister of State's presence. I came home from speaking at a dinner in the Weston Hotel last weekend. I walked through Westmoreland Street and O'Connell Street and called into a shop to buy a bottle of milk. I was struck that there were six packs of beer and bottles of wine available in the shop. To my astonishment, there were full bottles of whiskey on the top shelf. I asked the shop assistants about this in several shops. One of them was certainly not an Irish national and had difficulty speaking English. I wonder about his qualification to dispense alcohol at 11.10 p.m. on a Friday. He told me I could have a full bottle of whiskey. That is pouring petrol on an already dangerous situation and it should be stopped. If judges are compelled, because of our stupidity as legislators, to wallop out these licences, then we are remiss and must look at the situation. However, if that is not the case, then we should establish a proper mechanism for civilised communication between the judges and the Oireachtas so that this type of situation is avoided.

I have studiously tried not to apportion blame and not to breach the sub judice ruling even though if I was a mean-minded person, I probably could get away with it. Few sensible people would think it appropriate, when there is already a massive problem of public drunkenness in the city centre of Dublin and of other cities, for supermarkets staffed by inexperienced people to be allowed to hand out, not only six packs, but bottles of wine and whiskey. Everybody would agree there is something wrong with that and I hope the Minister of State will be able to address it.