Michael Finucane (Fine Gael)

I wish the Minister of State could convince the Minister for Finance. In 1998, there were 40,000 participants on the scheme. AnCO and FÁS were the forerunners of this scheme. As a result of the schemes, there was a great growth of community centres in rural areas. Another pattern then followed and many of the schemes became involved in practical activities in towns and villages.

My concern is that the scheme probably will be further reduced at the end of the year and the long-term objective is to get rid of it entirely. If this is done, a vacuum will remain unless alternative finance is put in place. The alternative finance will have to be met by the local authorities as they probably will have to employ additional staff to carry out the work currently carried out under community employment schemes.

Senator Mansergh referred to GAA clubs. Many GAA clubs, and others sports clubs, rely on people participating in the community employment scheme. The Minister of State spoke of encouraging volunteerism. There has been a change in society as regards volunteerism. People are under pressure through work and financial commitments. Much research has been carried out on the lack of volunteerism in the United States of America; the book Bowling Alone deals with the American experience. While the Minster of State's encouragement of voluntary activity is laudable, I am unsure how successful it will be.

The rural social programme is correct and I am prepared to give it a chance. It may give a chance to farming smallholders who need a top-up income. I wonder where it dovetails into place. Does it replace or extend the farm assist that is currently paidby the Department of Social and Family Affairs? Although this was announced in the budget, we have seen no concrete proof of it. Senator Ulick Burke has tried in vain to find details of the programme and how people can participate in it. I hope those details will be forthcoming soon. I am sure the 2,500 additional places will be taken up.

I respect what was said about FÁS; it has done excellent work over the years. I worked with AnCO for ten years. When I joined AnCO it had approximately 200 employees. FÁS subsumed AnCO and the National Manpower Service and became a large organisation. I accept that at certain times in the cycle of such a body, its functions must be re-appraised. I am sure this is currently being examined within FÁS.

We are glad to have tabled this motion. Community employment schemes are often raised with Members in their constituencies. Public meetings are often held when schemes are amalgamated and concerns are expressed about reductions in numbers. Members are often asked to seek flexibility from local FÁS representatives. This issue has become more contentious in recent times as there are concerns about the reduction in the number of places.

I will not talk about what took place earlier. The trading of insults reminded me of the "Oprah Winfrey Show". I suppose this is part of the normal political banter.

Amendment put.