Shane Ross (Independent)

I do not share all Senator O'Toole's sentiments. Any effort to shake up the public service is good because it is high time it was shaken up. If it must start with pensions, that is all to the good because of the limited opportunity to shake up a service which has got its way virtually everywhere.

I see the problems pointed out by Senator O'Toole. If he is right and this means no more national pay deals, I welcome it. If part of the Minister's plot is to decide to bring about a scenario which will challenge the public service, and if the public service, like Senator O'Toole, says it will have no more pay deals, then let us have no more of them. We have had enough of them. Let us end them and go ahead with free collective bargaining.