Martin Mansergh (Fianna Fail)

It was clear from the debate yesterday that all who were present had a united view on this issue. I did some research on the Government offices that have number twos. The Attorney General's Office has a Director General and a Deputy Director General. The CSO has two Directors. The Civil Service Commission has a Chairman and two Commissioners. The Department of Communications, Marine and Natural Resources has a Secretary General and an Assistant Secretary General. The Director of Public Prosecutions has a deputy. The Department of Foreign Affairs has a Secretary General, a second Secretary General, a Government press secretary and a deputy press secretary. In the Minister of State's own office there is a chairman and two commissioners. The Revenue has three commissioners. The Department of the Taoiseach has a Secretary General and a second Secretary General. The Departments I have not mentioned have a number of assistant secretaries.

Two anomalies arise here. At one end of the spectrum we have the Department of Finance, which has two Secretaries General and three second Secretaries General. I have great respect and time for the Department of Finance, and I do not want anyone to think otherwise, but there might be an element of quis custodiet ipsos custodes in terms of the lean, efficient operation of Government. At the other end of the spectrum there will be a new Department or commission which will have one Secretary General and, I understand, although I have this second hand, six principal officers. It will not even have assistant secretaries, let alone a deputy Secretary General. It would be a caricature and a misinterpretation to suggest that of all the offices of State, the Houses of the Oireachtas are the least among them but one could be forgiven for having that impression.

This commission needs to have not only the Clerk of the Dáil, who operates in a number of different capacities about which we spoke yesterday, inform it but also the Clerk of the Seanad, even if not as a voting member. In the rainbow coalition, and during the last Fianna Fáil-Progressive Democrats Government, former Deputy Molloy was a Minister of State at the Cabinet table. The input and contribution the Clerk of the Seanad can make to the work of this commission would be invaluable. Senator Higgins made the very good point that in certain general elections there may be a large turnover of personnel, particularly in this House. Obviously, the permanent staff provide continuity and the newcomers to the House will take time to learn the ropes and find their feet.

I have to register my disappointment, indeed my protest, that we do not have an amendment to this effect from the Government. Naturally, as an obedient, disciplined member of the party to which I belong, I will not do a John Deasy on this subject.