Martin Mansergh (Fianna Fail)

I do not accept the Minister of State's argument. The Clerk of the Dáil is a member of the commission in two capacities that are set out. He is there as the chief civil servant running the Oireachtas but also as an immensely important civil servant who has years of experience of the workings of the Dáil. That experience is of benefit. I do not accept that he is only there as someone who administers the Houses. I see no rational reason there should only be one civil servant or the Clerk of Seanad could not assist the Clerk of the Dáil.

It is a question of the respect due to this House. Is the Seanad a House of the Oireachtas or is it half a House? The Government should learn to respect the Seanad and there should be a civil servant to represent it. I do not believe there is anyone on the Government side who would disagree with me. I would be grateful if the Minister of State would take that opinion back to the Minister for Finance and tell him it is the unanimous view of the Seanad.

There is no question that, in terms of Civil Service back-up, the Clerk of the Seanad has something to contribute. What is this artificial construct that only one civil servant may be attached to this body? Joint committees of the Oireachtas have more than one civil servant attached. The test should be if the Clerk of the Seanad can contribute something substantial to the work of the commission. That case is unarguable.