Brian Hayes (Fine Gael)

I second the motion. I thank Senator Bradford for putting the position, outlined by our party a month ago, in such a succinct way. I am glad that we are debating the issue because many colleagues have sought such a debate for a number of months and it is right and proper that it should take place.

Seán Lemass was one of Ireland's greatest politicians. He emerged quickly from the independence movement as a modern, progressive leader who was prepared to change. Together with T. K. Whitaker, he fundamentally changed economic policy as Taoiseach and Minister for Finance. One of his abiding truisms from the 1950s was that if we are part of Europe, we must defend Europe.

That is important, particularly for the Fianna Fáil party, which has a problem with neutrality historically. The party's problem is not based on policy in terms of the global sense of neutrality, but on the hangover from Ireland's antagonistic relationship with Britain, its nearest neighbour, during the earlier part of the last century. That is understandable because, following Independence, the relationship with Britain was difficult because of Northern Ireland. We have moved on from that because the Northern issue, constitutionally at least, has been resolved. Both sovereign peoples accept the constitutional position of Northern Ireland. The hangover from that relationship, as Senator Bradford stated, resonates with Fianna Fáil's position on neutrality. There are interesting signs of movements afoot within the party in this regard.

Movement on neutrality will not come from Fianna Fáil because of the party's pragmatism and sense of doing the right thing for this generation by redefining what we mean when we say that we want to be part of a new European security and defence structure. Problems will be caused by the left because it has been utterly dishonest on the issue of neutrality. I refer to the recent debacle on the war on Iraq. If the European Council had taken a position on Iraq, through qualified majority voting or a simple majority, it would not have been agreed by Spain or Great Britain, although it would have been agreed by France, Germany and other countries that were hostile to the US action.