We can learn from other legislatures. The bicameral system has operated very well in the United Kingdom. Senator Hayes and I recently and separately met the Leader of the House of Lords. The systems operating in Finland, Denmark and Germany give a special role to the Upper Houses regarding the scrutiny and exposition of policies. Ministers come to the Upper Houses before travelling onwards in Europe where they can be swamped by COREPER. It is important to have transparent scrutiny of all these matters.