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Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: He did not need to get it from NAMA.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I welcome Mr. Long. He had not worked with NAMA prior to the sale of Project Eagle. This was his first engagement with them.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It is a big amount of cash, is it not? It is a great fee for a truncated deal. NAMA referred to this as a bespoke deal.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Indeed. When Lazard was appointed there was no tender process. Who in NAMA approached Lazard?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: With Ronnie Hanna. What was Cian Kealy’s role in NAMA? Can Mr. Long recall that?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It was to be NAMA's standard procedure that there would be such a process. Mr. Long then got a verbal briefing.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am assuming in the course of any transaction the information and data is in the possession of the client that Lazard is representing. That was hardly unusual in the case of NAMA.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Lazard did not need to have the oversight of the data room but NAMA did.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Does it bother Mr. Long that it was a bespoke and unique arrangement and that Lazard’s role was very limited, or more limited in NAMA terms, than other transactions at around the same time? Looking at all of these factors, one could come to a conclusion or a suspicion that Lazard was prepared to go along with whatever NAMA suggested. One could be forgiven for thinking that rather...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: No, it is the political sensitivity of protecting taxpayers' money. I will return to it in the second round, as I wish to conclude with this. Cerberus, at the highest level, met senior NAMA executives and the Minister for Finance on 31 March, a day before its bid was submitted. What does Mr. Long have to say about that? Was he aware that the meeting took place?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Did Fortress similarly meet Mr. Frank Daly and Mr. McDonagh of NAMA and the Minister? Was it afforded the same meeting?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Is Mr. Long angry that NAMA misled him and kept him in the dark?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: How does Lazard keep itself on the right side of the law? I am sure because it read the report that PIMCO approached NAMA with concerns about the law and compliance with the law here and in Britain. I have a sense that we are discussing the fees which Mr. Long says are standard and we are missing-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: ...appropriate but that it was potentially illegal. As the loan sales adviser, how did Mr. Long ensure that the law was not broken? I am very surprised that Mr. Long is so mild in his response to NAMA and the fact, as it seems to me, that he was deliberately kept in the dark. It appears from the board minutes, which Mr. Long has also read, that they deliberately did not tell Lazard about...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Mr. Long harbours no professional angst at the fact that NAMA kept that information from him.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: In terms of "what ifs" if PIMCO had not approached NAMA and this had just sailed through Lazard would have been a party to something outside of the regulation and the law potentially.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am very concerned because much of the conversation around this report from the Comptroller and Auditor General, NAMA's response and all of the debate has been anchored in an idea of reputational damage.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: ...reputational damage to the Office of the Comptroller and Auditor General, which as Mr. Long is aware is a constitutional office. There is also a lot of angst in respect of reputational damage to NAMA. I put it to Mr. Long as the representative of Lazard that reputational damage accrues to himself also. With the greatest of respect to Mr. Long far from demonstrating insight and judgment,...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: .... Lazard received a verbal briefing from Ronnie Hanna in which it was told about political sensitivities and so on. It had no role in valuation. It did not control the data room: that fell to NAMA. The whole process then became very complicated and compromised to the extent that there was legal concerns around the key bidder, about which Lazard is not informed, and that bidder exits....

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (22 Nov 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Let me come at this in a different way. I ask Mr. Long to pull up paragraph 4.17 of the report on his screen. In regard to the arrangement between Lazard and NAMA and the confidentiality which Mr. Long has referenced several times, it states that potential bidders were to be prohibited from contacting the debtors. In other words, there was to be a Chinese wall in terms of debtor...

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