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Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: In effect, the Deputy is asking me to speak for NAMA and explain-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: I think the Deputy's questions should be addressed to NAMA. I cannot look inside the heads of the people in NAMA who decided this was the best way forward, or the board of NAMA. All I can do is examine the record. It seems that it was a credible process, but there are other views.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: No. That is concise. The Act states NAMA must get best value for the taxpayer.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: ...What I said was I am specifically excluded, as all committee members are and every other politician, in either jurisdiction, from interfering or advising or influencing the commercial decisions of NAMA.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: I did not intervene because the issues that arose from the payment to Mr. Cushnahan, or the alleged payment to Mr. Cushnahan, were brought to the attention of NAMA by PIMCO, which at that point was the preferred bidder, and PIMCO withdrew from the sale.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: As far as NAMA was concerned, then that issue was not relevant to the sale subsequently and its advice was, and its decision as a board-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: Minister Lenihan, the late Brian Lenihan. Sammy Wilson, finance Minister of Northern Ireland, recommended his appointment to the late Brian Lenihan, and he was appointed by the board of NAMA following that recommendation. When I read this subsequently-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: At the time of the withdrawal of PIMCO, and the subsequent assurance from Cerberus, NAMA thought this was sufficient to ensure that no former or current NAMA officials were associated with the buyer, and it decided for good and sufficient reason to proceed with the sale. If it had taken the opposite course, does the Deputy not think that a great collapse-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: ...that there was sufficient competitive tension still in the process to allow the process to proceed with a sale to the remaining interested parties, was a commercial decision by the board of NAMA. I have no-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: I am advised that draft one and draft two were only advanced to NAMA. Draft three was the first to come to us.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: .... If the Comptroller and Auditor General says, as he said that night when I saw the report from the time he gave evidence here, that working out the assets to 2020 would have been an option for NAMA, it would not in my view. NAMA was required under law to work out its assets expeditiously. There was then the fact that the NAMA bonds which it had paid for the loan assets to the banks...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: The reason I am doing this is that the committee has focused a lot, rightly on the events and Northern Ireland, but there is another context. NAMA was represented at the meetings with the troika; therefore, it would very much have been aware of the other context. I am saying the committee should not assume that NAMA was responding to political pressure when it speeded up the sale of its...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: .... The Committee of Public Accounts is the place where a discussion on the Comptroller and Auditor General's report and the divergences of opinion between the Comptroller and Auditor General and NAMA can be resolved. There may be other issues arising and the Government has already announced that there are discussions with party leaders to further matters.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: In general, NAMA did a very good job. When it started out, nobody thought that it would even break even. It is now due to bring in a surplus of some €3 billion.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: On the particular deal, in the light of circumstances and the knowledge available at the time, it seemed that NAMA had done a good job. As a matter of fact, the Comptroller and Auditor General's office conducted an audit in 2014 and did not bring to my attention or that of anyone else that it had a problem with the sale of Project Eagle in terms of a loss to the taxpayer. That was after the...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: My position is that it has not been proved that there was a loss, but the Comptroller and Auditor General says there was a probable loss, while NAMA states there was no probable loss.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: ...a different process on a different timeline with a different discount rate - they are the three elements - it could have been avoided. I do not know whether he is right or wrong but I know that NAMA has a different view. That is why I have an open mind on it.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: -----and NAMA would have got more money from the sale.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: Yes, but it is a matter for NAMA. I addressed it as I understand it, but who keeps a minute at a NAMA board meeting or how full it is or whether it is just a record of decisions made or a verbatim report are not matters for me.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Michael Noonan: Again, it is a matter for NAMA. I cannot help the Deputy in that regard.

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