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Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Cuireadh an Seanad ar fionraí ar 5 p.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 5.16 p.m. Sitting suspended at 5 p.m. and resumed at 5.16 p.m.

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Fintan Warfield: I move amendment No. 23: In page 12, line 21, to delete “Regulation;” and substitute the following: “Regulation. Under this Act, all records relating to the adoption or informal care arrangement of a relevant person are considered to be that person’s personal data, regardless of whether that data is shared with another person. Personal data in relation to a...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Victor Boyhan: I do not disagree with Senator McGreehan on most issues but I cannot stress enough that for someone to take a child that does not belong to them without parental consent - someone who is not acting in loco parentisand is without any legal status - and then to arrange and facilitate the adoption of that child is not the end of game or a process but is simply illegal. Children have...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Alice-Mary Higgins: I move amendment No. 9: In page 10, line 29, before “information” to insert “medical information, including”. Amendment No. 9 is just a slight change-around with regard to medical information. At the moment, the line under subsection (f) says-----

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Aisling Dolan: The Minister will come in again at the end. I thank Senator Higgins. I remind Members that all contributions should be made through the Chair.

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Joe O'Reilly: I am sorry, but could the sub-committee meeting at the back of the Chamber conclude, please? Amendments Nos. 22, 55 and 62 to 67, inclusive, are related and may be discussed together by agreement. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Alice-Mary Higgins: The Minister has said he will consider the question. My concern does not relate only to the definition of "genetic relative". My question is why we would limit that information to genetic relatives. However, since the Minister is reviewing the matter, I will not press the amendment at this time.

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Roderic O'Gorman: The Senator might look at section 2, which states: For the purposes of this Act, a person (“first mentioned person”) is the subject of an incorrect birth registration where— (a) as a result of the giving of information that was false or misleading ... That element of "false or misleading" that the Senator mentioned earlier on is directly included in section 2 and...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Victor Boyhan: I thank Senators Warfield, Boylan, Gavan and Ó Donnghaile for amendment No. 14. The amendment is extensive and cuts to the very core of many of the issues with this legislation. I do not know how we can justify calling it "incorrect" rather than "illegal". I will share an experience. I met a family last weekend. There were six children, all of whom were illegally adopted from thet...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Alice-Mary Higgins: However, it does not include "illegal" in the context of the reference to "false or misleading". It is relevant to those who have been affected by the St. Patrick’s Guild investigations, for example. For such a person, maybe his or her registration is in fact being investigated or is recognised as being illegal. Is the Minister suggesting that this is encompassed by the references...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Erin McGreehan: I would like to speak about the issue of illegality. In law, the term "illegal" is the end point. Something is deemed illegal at the end point in a court of law. To pre-empt something as illegal is to predetermine a judgment. Is it not the case that the term “false and misleading” is already in our legislation under the Civil Registration Act? That is just the term that is...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Roderic O'Gorman: I certainly think it helps and gives clarity in that circumstance of illegal birth registration. In terms of the release of the name, this is something on which I and the team in my Department have engaged extensively with the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel.It is something that has been raised at other stages of the debate on this legislation. We are talking about a balancing test that...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Alice-Mary Higgins: My amendment, No. 55, relates to the fact that, at the moment, the section requiring the relevant body to provide information on application by a relevant person aged 18 years or over, only provides for early life information, care information and incorrect birth registration information. As we discussed with regard to the definitions, medical information is categorised separately. The...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Fintan Warfield: I move amendment No. 14: In page 11, between lines 30 and 31, to insert the following: “ “illegal adoption” means an illegal adoption, where any of the following situations occurred: (a) where a non-marital child was registered as the natural child of the adoptive parents without the mother’s knowledge or consent and no adoption order was made; (b) where a...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Roderic O'Gorman: I thank all the Senators for their contributions on these amendments. Before I speak to amendments Nos. 56 to 61, inclusive, I want to say that Senator Boyhan is right to remind us all that, once this legislation is passed and operational and once adopted people are using its provisions, there are people who will be deeply disappointed because the information simply is not there. The...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Alice-Mary Higgins: I will be frank with the Minister; that is completely wrong. It is the same argument I had back in 2017 when I listened to the exact same discussions about birth certificates. I sat in ministerial offices hearing advice from Ministers. This was back when there was the assumption of a preference for privacy versus identity, with the assumption being made wrongly and, in fact, interfering...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Roderic O'Gorman: I thank the Senator. They are covered. The people who can use this legislation are covered in the definition of "relevant person", which means a person who is one or more of the following: an adopted person; and a person who is or has reasonable grounds for suspecting that he or she is the subject of an incorrect birth registration. There is a third category that is not relevant to this...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Alice-Mary Higgins: Fair enough. There will probably have to be a bit of back and forth because that clump actually deals with quite different topics. That is why I was surprised by the grouping. In terms of amendment No. 9, at the moment under subsection (f) it refers to "information on any medical treatments, procedures or vaccinations administered to him or her." I am specifying that it should refer to...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Victor Boyhan: I want to come back to the point Senator Seery Kearney made. I agree with her and she has articulated her point well. I was just touching on some examples but I agree with her that it is about managing that expectation and being responsible. In time, when this process starts to unravel, we will eventually know the institutions that kept forensic records. I could tell the Senator 20 of...

Seanad: Birth Information and Tracing Bill 2022: Committee Stage (18 May 2022)

Victor Boyhan: I will focus on two issues and speak to amendments Nos. 23 and 24, which are extensive and cover many areas. I will focus on a recurring theme in both amendments, that of the details applicable in terms of vaccines. Amendment No. 23 reads: “the relevant person’s medical records from birth until the time of placement, including x-rays, tests, vaccines”. Amendment No. 24...